observer Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 It appears that the tax-payer is to fund a £20million compen claim by relatives and survivors of the British fight against Mau Mau terrorists in Kenya, 50 years ago. So what next? A claim from relatives of the S/African Boers who suffered in British concentration camps? A claim from the Zulus, or any of the natives of the ex-British Empire? Jus how far back does this nonsense go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 I bet Bill Roach is asking the same question right about now. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Yet again, I've dmor for another obs thread, and (yet again), what I've found may or may not be what he's on about. Dunno if he'll answer me this time, or whether (yet again) he can't be arsed. Anyway, is this it?: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/06/britain-maumau-empire-waiting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Sid Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 can i put a claim in for my ancestor uuugh who got clubbed by a rival hunter whilst out hunting a mammoth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 can i put a claim in for my ancestor uuugh who got clubbed by a rival hunter whilst out hunting a mammoth? Didn't Tony Bliar already apologise for that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdrianR Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 3 years for injury claims. However the courts can apply discretion under S33 of the Limitation Act 1980. I suspect the latter has arisen here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 The salt in the wound, would be if they got legal aid towards this farce. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Farce, Obs, is the fight and struggle for freedom farce Obs????, The Colonial government used castration as a weapon!!!! Have you not been saying Germany should have paid war compensation on another thread, have you not just shot yourself in the foot with this one Or are you saying its ok for the UK to receive money when we are wronged, but the UK is never wrong and so should never pay it out. Why not just face the fact that's things got ugly when we were trying to keep hold of our Empire, and things there done, that should not have been done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
algy Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 can i put a claim in for my ancestor uuugh who got clubbed by a rival hunter whilst out hunting a mammoth? Only if you can produce reliable witness and the weapon that was used against them Sid!. PM me if you need a witness, I have a mate in Toxteth who will swear on oath that he saw the whole thing and not only that he will also produce the weapon and the mammoth skin for a few quid., might be a bit smelly though as he said it's been in his shed for about 15,000 years. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 As I've said before Kije, compensation goes to the victor, but only if the victor is in a position to enforce payment. Bleeding hearts like you, would have us paying through the nose in compen for every so-called historical war crime - history is just that, history - get over it and move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 But they were victorious Obs, as their war goal was met, Freedom from colonial rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wireboy Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Any compensation for the Ruck family? Thought not. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/.../Kenya-Mau-Mau-atrocities-1950s-dossier.ht... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Sad for the Ruck family, could they not put a claim into Kenya????, but if we are counting mis-deeds I think the UK will still be out of pocket, The really sad thing is, Their were other rebelions and other supressions by our Colonial Cival servants. We could be opening the flood gates here. The last days of are Empire got very dirty is some places, with us trying to hang on to what was left of out Empire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Nobody is mentioning mis-deeds. If the Mau Mau can claim against the British for atrocities, what about the atrocities that took place by the Mau-Mau? IMO, if you go into the kitchen, there is a possibility that you may get burned. Can the white farmers in Rhodesia(Zinbabwe) get compensation from Mugabe?? As obs says, just how far back to you take these issues? This country is the pits the way it bends over backwards to appease these people. I wonder how much compensation the IRA are going to pay out? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Victorious? Errm, think you'll find that the Mau Mau were defeated and their Leader killed. The withdrawal from Empire was a strategic post-war political decision by the British Gov, who simply could no longer afford to police and administer it, in the light of the devastation at home. As for "war crimes"; think you'll find that the Mau Mau were adept at torture and butchery, and mainly of their own black communities - a trait that's lingered on in Africa until the present day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Due to the unrest, as you said it was getting very expensive, they did win as their aim was self rule, which they got. The British aim was to stay, we lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Errm nope; the strategic decision to withdraw from Empire had already been made. The Mau Mau were defeated. Which left more moderate elements (like Kenyata) to reap the reward of withdrawal, and a peacefull transfer of powers. The Mau Mau were no different from the IRA, they were terrorists, and rightly imo treated as such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
algy Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 obs, define a terrorist, in your words without using one of the informative web sites, and please, not the old 'chestnut' - someone who strikes terror into the population or opposition!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 A terrorist is someone who has a bomb, but does not have an air force Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
algy Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Wolfie, keep yer' knose out I was askin' obs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Obs the decision to with draw had not been made in Kenya, if it had we would have not bothered to repress it as brutally as we did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Kije, the principle of withdrawal from all our colonies was well established by the post-war Atlee Gov, it was merely a matter of organising a transfer of powers, and timing for the various colonies; the timing of course didn't suit everyone of course, especially the various terrorist groups in those colonies. What you call "repression", was simply the maintainance of law and order, in the face of such violence. The withdrawal from Kenya, was in spite of Mau Mau activity, NOT because of it. Alg, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, and it depends which side your on and who writes the history at the end of the day, But, any minority group that endevours to overthrow a status quo by violent means, I would deem to be a terrorists, certainly from the point of view of the existing regime. The idea that these groups had majority local support for their activity is nonsense; as with the IRA, they even killed their own countrymen. Only in India, with Gandi, was there a non-violent opposition to British rule, which eventually succeeded by non-violent means; similar to the velvet revolutions against the Soviet Empire in E/Europe . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Most Kenyans wanted to be independent of the UK Obs, By your definition the Mau Mau are not terrorists. , But, any minority group that endevours to overthrow a status quo by violent means, I would deem to be a terrorists,. I minority took up arms, the majority supported the course. So not terrorists then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 .. and where's your evidence that a majority supported independence? Certainly not the many villagers that where massacred by the Mau Mau. I doubt the majority even thought about it, too busy trying to make a living.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Because they voted for Kenyatta, and independence, If Kenyatta had lost the election things might have been different, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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