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inky pete

A bit of traffic common sense at last!

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http://www.warrington-worldwide.co.uk/articles/18071/1/Anger-over-councils-rat-run-decision/Page1.html

 

So a small bunch of residents wanted a perfectly serviceable, publicly funded and maintained, alternative through route - which runs through their estate but has no houses on it - reserved for their sole use, and quite rightly have been told to get knotted.

 

Of course they didn't want it blocking off at one end because they still wanted to use it as a through route themselves, they just wanted it to be declared to be effectively their own private road.

 

Well if they wanted it to be a private road, why didn't they offer to buy it and adopt responsibility for the sewers and services running beneath it? I don't see why the rest of us should be expected to pay for a road we're not allowed to use. The residents don't even seem to realise that it's a bus route, so making it access only would lose them the estates only bus service.

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I started work at BNFL when I was 17 and Harpers Road has always been used as another route for getting from that side of Warrington to this.  Hardly a reason to make it access only just because some residents don't like having to queue up to get to their houses.

It says that making it access only would "give local residents a better chance of getting on to Harpers Road during the 'Rat Run' rush hour"..... I might campaign to get Wilderspool Causeway, Chester road and all the roads in between made access only so I can get to my house quicker :lol:

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As a resident of Longbarn i was also opposed to this plan. The traffic is only an issue between the hours of 7 til 10am then the rest of the time it’s a quiet road

 

Traffic on the east side of Warrington on the other hand is horrendous at times.

 

The main priority for Warrington east would be to sort out getting people from the M6 to Birchwood, not closing off a quiet road

 

I suggest giving Birchwood its own M6 junction and making Birchwood Way a dual carriageway for the whole length and the same with Woolston grange; it would solve some of the problems

 

The lack of investment across Warrington’s road network I firmly believe is holding the town back, and with an ever expanding population the problems will only get worse without serious investment

 

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The problem too with Birchwood & Woolston is that only the hint of a hold up at Croft interchange  is enough to get traffic to divert off the motorway.

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Could not agree more inky pete, and I actually live in Longbarn.

Harpers Road is only a problem between 07:30 and 9:30 in the morning, when it can be difficult to get out of any of the turnings, and you do rely on a certain amount of "Christian" motoring to be allowed to join the queue. It can be frustrating sitting in the Harpers Road traffic jam, but it is no worse than on many other roads all over Warrington during the so called rush hour.

What the whole of Warrington actually needs is joined up thinking about traffic management and transport within town, not just expensive the tinkering with traffic lights and roundabouts that appear to make things worse.

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I see that Cllr Settle is "Bitterly Disappointed"...... I wonder where he lives then seeing as most residents appear to have been against the decision anyway :)

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The idea for to close off Harpers road for through traffic has never been discussed to the majority of residents for example the first I knew about it was that there was a proposal in front of the traffic committee, and a colleague in work knew nothing about it and he lives in pasture lane.

 

The longbarn residents association is a good idea that has become a bit power crazy,

 

I am all for residents rallying together to pick up litter and making the area a nicer place to live by developing a community spirit.

 

I am not aware of how many members there are in the Longbarn association but I am sure it is not the whole estate; they keep bringing up issues that in the long run will cost other residents (who are not part of the association) money.

 

For example: Complaining about people parking from the industrial estates and walking through. The council could put in permit parking or double yellow lines in but the question would be where would visitors to the street to see family/friends park? Many of the driveways in that area are already full so on street parking is sometimes an unavoidable problem, (not that it is ever that much of a problem as somebody who played on the streets in questions I never felt unsafe).

 

The permits may be free in the first year but then the council I am sure would put a charge on this as an "administration fee" so residents would then require to pay for a permit so visitors could park outside their home.

 

The longbarn residents association are typical of the "Nimby" culture that I really don’t like.

 

As for the local councillors it must be getting close to election time as the leaflets have started coming through the doors again and their supporters have started walking around, we have not seen anything for 12 months but that is another topic.

 

 

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45, Gairloch Close, Cinnamon Brow, Warrington WA2 0SG - you can check this out on the Warrington Borough Council Web site - it's no great secret and is dead easy to find - check out this link http://www.warrington.gov.uk/councillors/58/geoff_settle

 

Geoff

 

I knew that already.... but why were you in favour of a proposal to make a road residents only when most of the residents obviously didn't want it and it would have caused even more traffic chaos for the majority of people and motorists in the area? Surely if someone wants to make their road for the exclusive of "local people" you have to have all of the "local people" on board? or is this just another example of Warringtons shambolic traffic management policy and anti-car agenda?

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A great problem is the increase in car ownership. When Warrington was designated as a new town  a lot of homes still didn't have one car & so the actual design of the area was ,for its time futuristic, but the norm these days is for every household to have as many as four cars spread between family members. I don't think many local authorities saw that whammy coming ,& far from being a tool to set man free ,the car is now a social problem.

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The idea for to close off Harpers road for through traffic has never been discussed to the majority of residents for example the first I knew about it was that there was a proposal in front of the traffic committee, and a colleague in work knew nothing about it and he lives in pasture lane. The longbarn residents association is a good idea that has become a bit power crazy, I am all for residents rallying together to pick up litter and making the area a nicer place to live by developing a community spirit. I am not aware of how many members there are in the Longbarn association but I am sure it is not the whole estate; they keep bringing up issues that in the long run will cost other residents (who are not part of the association) money. For example: Complaining about people parking from the industrial estates and walking through. The council could put in permit parking or double yellow lines in but the question would be where would visitors to the street to see family/friends park? Many of the driveways in that area are already full so on street parking is sometimes an unavoidable problem, (not that it is ever that much of a problem as somebody who played on the streets in questions I never felt unsafe). The permits may be free in the first year but then the council I am sure would put a charge on this as an "administration fee" so residents would then require to pay for a permit so visitors could park outside their home. The longbarn residents association are typical of the "Nimby" culture that I really don’t like. As for the local councillors it must be getting close to election time as the leaflets have started coming through the doors again and their supporters have started walking around, we have not seen anything for 12 months but that is another topic.

 

The council's aim is to make a surplus on parking. The loss making bits of that are council staff parking and residents parking. So they may be reluctant to have more residents schemes because that would make a surplus less likely/ impossible without either reducing the deficit on their own parking (as if) or putting up prices in the town's retail car parks to subsidise it.   

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This is the same old same old. A small group of residents object to something and pass it onto their local councillor whos then takes it up and makes it his or her mission in life. The fact that the vast majority understand the reality of todays transport issues and don't have any reall issues with it dosn't come into the equasion.

 

 

Bill :)

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The idea for to close off Harpers road for through traffic has never been discussed to the majority of residents for example the first I knew about it was that there was a proposal in front of the traffic committee, and a colleague in work knew nothing about it and he lives in pasture lane. The longbarn residents association is a good idea that has become a bit power crazy, I am all for residents rallying together to pick up litter and making the area a nicer place to live by developing a community spirit. I am not aware of how many members there are in the Longbarn association but I am sure it is not the whole estate; they keep bringing up issues that in the long run will cost other residents (who are not part of the association) money. For example: Complaining about people parking from the industrial estates and walking through. The council could put in permit parking or double yellow lines in but the question would be where would visitors to the street to see family/friends park? Many of the driveways in that area are already full so on street parking is sometimes an unavoidable problem, (not that it is ever that much of a problem as somebody who played on the streets in questions I never felt unsafe). The permits may be free in the first year but then the council I am sure would put a charge on this as an "administration fee" so residents would then require to pay for a permit so visitors could park outside their home. The longbarn residents association are typical of the "Nimby" culture that I really don’t like. As for the local councillors it must be getting close to election time as the leaflets have started coming through the doors again and their supporters have started walking around, we have not seen anything for 12 months but that is another topic.

The Council run pemit scheme was only ever free for the residents near to the Wolves Stadium.

Any new schemes will cost residents £60 per car.

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This is the same old same old. A small group of residents object to something and pass it onto their local councillor whos then takes it up and makes it his or her mission in life. The fact that the vast majority understand the reality of todays transport issues and don't have any reall issues with it dosn't come into the equasion.

 

 

Bill :)

Well Bill - I arrananged 3 meetings back in 2011 to discuss this and the other issues around the impact of the National Crimes Agency and their travel plans as well as the exieting traffic flow issues and they were quite heated meetings. They school hall was packed and attended by the police, NCA manager, WBC traffic officers and residents. 

 

More recently with the formation of the Longbarn Residents Association and their growing membership I have attended meeting with 60 plus residents at the Village Club.

 

Now if each one represents a person from each household or approximately 14% of the residents, not a bad turn out in my opinion.

 

Are you saying Bill that I should ignore this small number of people and tell them that they are insignificant? :twisted:

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14% is not a bad turnout but not a majority either. Perhaps a carefully worded survey might get a better result,( one of those that give you the result you want.) 8)

 

Although I am sure that if you pointed out that a bypass could be provided to take the traffic from that particular road but would mean an extra fifty pounds on their council tax they would be up in arms about that as well.

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As with the people who understand the hold ups caused by the swing bridges & plan their journeys to cater for any hold ups ,maybe the Harper's Road locals could leave for their appointments  10 minutes earlier. Another factor that  doesn't help these days is the school run......surely a fair percentage of this traffic could be avoided if mothers & fathers took their kids to school  on foot. Who knows the added benefits of walking could also save parents a few bob at the gym as well . Now that makes sense.

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Now if each one represents a person from each household or approximately 14% of the residents, not a bad turn out in my opinion.

 

How on earth do you justify an assumption like that!

 

I would think that it would be far more likely that husband and wife from a houshold would attend such a meeting together, so you're going to be closer to 30 or 40 housholds out of 1000+ represented - hardly a significant proportion.

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How on earth do you justify an assumption like that!

 

It was a typical council type assumption. The assumption that they are correct and the rest of us are wrong.

 

Don't forget, this lot have hiked up the council tax bills by yet another 2% this year (or is that 1.99% so that they can get away without being challenged?) Making roads resident only is out of order when there is no viable alternative, and even when there is it is still a flaky subject. Don't forget, no one is entitled to their own parking space outside their houses so why, when we have the wondrous 20 zones (another shed load of wasted cash) are we being threatened with being banned from a road which everyone in the town pays for? Did the residents association ever offer to pay for ALL of the upkeep and maintenance on their private bit of the Warrington roadways I wonder or did they expect everyone else to pay for it for use by a special few?

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Now if each one represents a person from each household or approximately 14% of the residents, not a bad turn out in my opinion.

 

Are you saying Bill that I should ignore this small number of people and tell them that they are insignificant? :twisted:

 

 

Tell them that if they want their road closed that they too must give up their vehicles and they have to pay for any enforcment.

 

It is unfair that people get roads closed off to traffic yet keep their cars, motorbikes and vans causing traffic,danger and polution on the road other people live on

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If they want the road closed then close it to all traffic and make it a pedestrian way only, block off each end and problem solved, no queueing traffic, no rat run, no dangerous traffic and a lot of happy residents. There is a simple solution to every problem and to me that is the simplest.

 

That there will then be several dozen houses that can no longer get cars in or out to go to work or have their groceries delivered after shopping online due to not being able to get their cars out is something that can be sorted out in a few years time. But think of the benefits to the environment of all those cars no longer on the road, the increase in health of all the residents and their children due to having to walk a mile or so to the nearest bus stop and all the peace and quite due to no traffic noise in the area, the increased revenue to the bus operators, who may even be able to make a small profit out of the increased bus usage, and a feather in the cap of the local MP for making it all possible.An all round win.

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Geoff, dont talk to me about how you interpret statistics. The last time that happened in this area, the council claimed they had over 90% support when in actual fact the real figures showed 85% were dead against their plans. Try your theory out down at the local pub instead of a meetings called by objectors, then come back here and tell us about how much support you have.

 

Bill :)

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