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Gaiety Theatre Warrington


algy
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  • 2 months later...

Possible, although unusually I don't remember, what I can tell you is it is situated on the right corner of Parker Street by the traffic lights just before either turning right into Sankey Street or turning left into Liverpool Road and over Bank Quay railway bridge and if you go straight on you are in Crosfield Street.

Map about 1893/4

ScreenShot004.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

I hope Algy (or someone else) solves it too Cleo as I can't find anything either and it's bugging me again now it has resurfaced.

 

Algy... is that the last map it appears on ? Does it appear on any earlier maps? What other buildings or house numbers were near to it any idea ?

 

Aaargh... :shock::unsure::lol:

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I hope Algy (or someone else) solves it too Cleo as I can't find anything either and it's bugging me again now it has resurfaced.

 

Algy... is that the last map it appears on ? Does it appear on any earlier maps? What other buildings or house numbers were near to it any idea ?

 

Aaargh... :shock::unsure::lol:

Not on this map of 1890 so the building would have been built between 1890 and 1893/4,

ScreenShot002.jpg

 

The building appears on the 1907 map but no title name on the map.

ScreenShot001.jpg

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Bugger :huh:

 

I couldn't find anything obvious on the 1891 census but unless there was someone resident there at the time that is understandable although some building are not listed where you expect to find them or are recorded incorrectly.

 

OK wo where to look next.. I have no idea... any suggestions? I

 

I have full access to all the info on Ancestry and Find My Past if you have any suggestions or info on buildings on either side. I really don't think it will help much though but I will look all the same :oops:

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This is starting to frustrate and annoy me as I have seen reference to this theatre on the net in a very old report about an actor who appeared here in the early 1900's, can I find it again, No!. :angry::roll:

Dizz, if you have the 1891 census try coming up Dixon Street towards Sankey Street.

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I just had a quick look on the 1891 FMP census for that street and it only shows houses 5,7,8,9,11,13,15,17,19,21,23,25,27,29,31,33,35. All odd numbers (excpet No 8 ). 1881 has the same although no number 29 and one other after 35 nut not numbered. 1911 similar too and the road does not seem to exist on the 1871. Wonder why they just used odd numbers. Anyway not that that is much help. H have looked through most of the 'other establishments' oddities but haven't found it so far. Will check out Ancestry later.

 

One think I have just noticed though is that on your 1st and also 3rd third map where you say "Not on this map of 1890 so the building would have been built between 1890 and 1893/4" if you look to the right of your big red cross it does actually say 'Gaiety Theatre' but on the opposite side of Dixon Street with the text running downwards along side the building on that side.

 

Could it be that it was actually on that side and maybe quite small and that the map of 'about 1893/4' is slightly misleading and makes it appear to have been on the larger area of land where your x is ? I have seen similar things before when looking at old maps of around here whereby the text position leads the eye to believe a slightly different position than things were KNOWN to have been.

 

Still doesn't explain we can't find it though..... grrrr ... keep looking eh :lol:

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This is starting to frustrate and annoy me as I have seen reference to this theatre on the net in a very old report about an actor who appeared here in the early 1900's, can I find it again, No!. :angry::roll:

 

Is this it Algy.....

 

"17 - 31 July 1886, The Era: Letter/s awaited Will Mitcham in London while he was appearing at the Gaiety Theatre, Warrington"

 

found here

 

http://www.wells-genealogy.org.uk/wilmitcham.htm (just over half way down)

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Is this it Algy.....

 

"17 - 31 July 1886, The Era: Letter/s awaited Will Mitcham in London while he was appearing at the Gaiety Theatre, Warrington"

 

found here

 

http://www.wells-genealogy.org.uk/wilmitcham.htm (just over half way down)

Well done Dizz, that is definitely the one, the only problem I foresee is the date that is given is 1886 where as the 1890 map above doesn't show a building there?,

where the BH do we go from here?. :unsure:

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No probs but the 1880 map does show the words Gaiety Theatre on the right of Dixon Street as you look at it (ie to the right of your big red X). I mentioned that earlier :P

 

I'm tending to definately lean towards the fact that the theatre was there and NOT on the big plot of land where you have marked (next to number 5 Dixon Street) :blink::oops:

 

The enumerator started at number 5 Dixon then walked down (away from your X) and then back up again (and odly according to the schedule numbers 'nunber 8' seems to have been at the top of the right hand side just as he turned right into Sankey Street) and then he recored number 139 Sankey next as he turned right. That is righ on the corner but no mention of a theatre, just a family living there with the head being a baker.

 

I feel like I know the area and it's past residents well now though having looked at so many census records for the area and following the enumerators footsteps along his route as it were :lol: I'm not sure who is more obsessed now, you or me ??

 

Where do we go from here... well the royal 'we' shall keep looking I guess, unless we are lucky and we have some real oldies reading who remember something. Perhaps Gary could put a 'help does anyone remember the Gaiety' on the news page :lol:

 

Have you asked Warrington Library or museum though as they may know more and maybe they even have a photo of it in their collections :D

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Have you asked Warrington Library or museum though as they may know more and maybe they even have a photo of it in their collections :D

Dizz, have been with the 'oldies' in the "Grumpy Old Men's Club" tonight and put the word out about the 'Gaiety Theatre' and although none of them new anything about the subject they will 'tap' all their resources to find out as much information as they can, even got Mike the Mayor on the case. :wink::D :grin:

PS. Really shouldn't post after having a few jars. :wink:

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:lol::lol:

 

You have the Mayor on the case :shock: Flippin' heck one moves in high circles these days :lol::wink:

Nah! it's Mike that moves in lower circles and always has done since I have known him, Anyway the blummin' Mayor has to be useful for something. :wink::D

 

Getting back to topic I went and had a look round Dixon Street this morning and had a good look at the building that I thought may have been the Gaiety, and to me, no way is that brickwork Victorian, the design is 1920's Art Deco in the way the design and brick courses have been laid, so I would say that if the theatre had been there it had been knocked down around 1920 and this building built in it's place, in Dixon Street opposite this building as you have suggested is the most likely site for the Gaiety, obviously they have knocked it down and built large terraced houses on the plot.

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Mmmmm ....]Whilst searching I came across a rather large and interesting document produced by WBC in 2009.

 

In it it has a section about the Historical Development of the Town Centre and says that ".......In the late 19th - early 20th century a street improvement scheme was carried out that included the widening of the four principle streets [bridge Street, Sankey, Horsemarket, Buttermarket].

 

The widening of Bridge Street to 18m commenced from 1880 with Sankey Street Following. This included the provisions of new commercial frontages."

 

You of course know all about the street widenings but did the widening of Sankey Street go down as far as where the theatre was ? Could tie in with it;s disapearance from the maps I suppose.

 

So I don't get done for copyright here is a link to the whold document (historical stuff starts on page 17)

 

Warrington Town Centre Public Realm Strategy - The Vision

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Mmmmm ....]Whilst searching I came across a rather large and interesting document produced by WBC in 2009.

 

In it it has a section about the Historical Development of the Town Centre and says that ".......In the late 19th - early 20th century a street improvement scheme was carried out that included the widening of the four principle streets [bridge Street, Sankey, Horsemarket, Buttermarket].

 

The widening of Bridge Street to 18m commenced from 1880 with Sankey Street Following. This included the provisions of new commercial frontages."

 

You of course know all about the street widenings but did the widening of Sankey Street go down as far as where the theatre was ? Could tie in with it;s disapearance from the maps I suppose.

Warrington Town Centre Public Realm Strategy - The Vision

 

Sankey Street widening only affected the section from Legh Street to market Gate the west end already being wide.

Looking at Worrals's Directory 1895 the last property on the left towards Bank Quay bridge was No.127 on the r.hand corner (facing), occupied by Walter Morton, Electrical Engineer, Maggin Bros Coach Proprietors, then came Dixon Street and no other property mentioned, then Parker Street.

Recently there was a restaurant for sale No 139 Sankey Street (photos below), I think the block of properties were built on the site of the Gaiety Theatre some time between 1890 & 1907 as the appear on the 1907 map.

 

14213.jpg

 

14143.jpg

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Aaargh ... Why do you keep saying it appears on the 1907 map when it doesn't actually name or mention it :blink::lol:

 

Are you playing mind games with me Algy cos if you are you are definately winning as I have no idea what I am doing now (not that I did anyway) :lol:

 

I shall keep looking... but just for the hell of it, and I shall tell you anyway just to get my own back, Walter Morton (electrical Engineer) who was based at no 127 was from Yorkshire and was aged 24 in 1891 and at that time he was a lodger living at 14 Beamont Street with Mr Thomas Field Hookwa(y?) a Railway engineer and his wife..... :P He (and they) seem to disapprear after then so they either all dropped dead due to overwork of trying to earn a living in Warrington or the all moved elsewhere to get away from over development,. I think they probably popped their clogs though and gave up due to stress.

 

Number 139 doesn't seem to have existed unless it did but no one lived there.

 

So moving on

 

 

In 1901 the building on the corner in your photo (ie number 139) was the residence of

 

HANNAN, John E - Head - Married - M - 30 dob 1871 - Assistant Manager (Bakery)

HANNAN, Clara - Wife - Married - F - 22 - 1879

HANNAN, Ernest - Son - M - 2 1899

HANNAN, Elizabeth - Mother - Widow - F 5- 8 - 1843

RICHARDS, Mabel - Sister-In-Law - Single - F - 20 - 1881 - General Servant Domestic

RICHARDS, Lottie S- ister-In-Law - F - 11 - 1890

 

Still no mention of a theatre and all were from staffordshire.

 

The record preceeding it was Number 8 Dixon - resident Ann Foulk(as ?) Widow and family - unemployed, plus a few others

 

Next preceeding were numbers 35,3l Dixon etc. Why does number 8 keep coming after number 35 ?

 

Perhaps the theatre was at number 8 and was built after the other houses/buildings on the corner of Dixon street but then closed down and/or was demolished as quickly as it emerged.

 

tomorrow Algy ... I'm all confused and very sleeoy now :mellow:

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Aaargh ... Why do you keep saying it appears on the 1907 map when it doesn't actually name or mention it :blink::lol:

 

Are you playing mind games with me Algy cos if you are you are definately winning as I have no idea what I am doing now (not that I did anyway) :lol:

 

I shall keep looking... but just for the hell of it, and I shall tell you anyway just to get my own back, Walter Morton (electrical Engineer) who was based at no 127 was from Yorkshire and was aged 24 in 1891 and at that time he was a lodger living at 14 Beamont Street with Mr Thomas Field Hookwa(y?) a Railway engineer and his wife..... :P He (and they) seem to disapprear after then so they either all dropped dead due to overwork of trying to earn a living in Warrington or the all moved elsewhere to get away from over development,. I think they probably popped their clogs though and gave up due to stress.

 

Number 139 doesn't seem to have existed unless it did but no one lived there.

 

So moving on

 

 

In 1901 the building on the corner in your photo (ie number 139) was the residence of

 

HANNAN, John E - Head - Married - M - 30 dob 1871 - Assistant Manager (Bakery)

HANNAN, Clara - Wife - Married - F - 22 - 1879

HANNAN, Ernest - Son - M - 2 1899

HANNAN, Elizabeth - Mother - Widow - F 5- 8 - 1843

RICHARDS, Mabel - Sister-In-Law - Single - F - 20 - 1881 - General Servant Domestic

RICHARDS, Lottie S- ister-In-Law - F - 11 - 1890

 

Still no mention of a theatre and all were from staffordshire.

 

The record preceeding it was Number 8 Dixon - resident Ann Foulk(as ?) Widow and family - unemployed, plus a few others

 

Next preceeding were numbers 35,3l Dixon etc. Why does number 8 keep coming after number 35 ?

 

Perhaps the theatre was at number 8 and was built after the other houses/buildings on the corner of Dixon street but then closed down and/or was demolished as quickly as it emerged.

 

tomorrow Algy ... I'm all confused and very sleeoy now :mellow:

Sorry about the 1907 error Dizz, I get confused by looking at the numbers floating round, what I really meant is that the property on the right corner of Dixon Street (looking down at the 1894/96 map) which thanks to you we both think could be the Gaiety does NOT appear on the 1907 map, but was replaced by the present properties featured in the two present day photos, the building with the curved wall that started us looking at this situation seems to have been lost in the ensuing melee, and has got me thinking it may have been as I think Baz said a Garage or perhaps storage facility for the railway as in 1850 the station was not at the junction of Wilson Patten Street and Parker Street it was at the top of Parker Street by Bank Quay bridge as was the old Patten Arms (where Dunelm is now situated)

which by 1894/96, the Station had been demolished and the Old Patten Arms no longer a pub, both being replaced by the present buildings at the south end of Parker Street,with the land vacated by the station and public house being replaced by a large goods siding consisting of eleven buffer stopped goods lines, the storage facility was on the other side of the bridge in Crossfield Street, but were there stables or some type of storage building erected by the Railway Company on the junction/corner of Parker Street and Sankey Street to store road horses or wagons/carts. Pure conjecture I know, but until any information more factual comes along that is all we have. I would welcome any information or ideas on this subject, :unsure:

 

1850

ScreenShot003.jpg

 

1894/96

ScreenShot004-1.jpg

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Anyone have any information on the "Gaiety Theatre on the corner of Sankey Street and Parker Street, until viewing the map of 1894/96 below I had not been aware of it's existence.

ScreenShot002.jpg

 

Algie looking at that map the theatre is definitely in the location of Crosfields garage ,but i do wonder about the accuracy of some of the maps , particularly the one showing park buildings & marble works at the site of what is now Aldi/Iceland.That site always used to be a railway yard & it probably was at the date of the map.

Your photograph in post #18 shows a corner of Crosfields garage , the building with the "no through road" sign next to it in the lower picture.

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Sankey Street widening only affected the section from Legh Street to market Gate the west end already being wide.

Looking at Worrals's Directory 1895 the last property on the left towards Bank Quay bridge was No.127 on the r.hand corner (facing), occupied by Walter Morton, Electrical Engineer, Maggin Bros Coach Proprietors, then came Dixon Street and no other property mentioned, then Parker Street.

Recently there was a restaurant for sale No 139 Sankey Street (photos below), I think the block of properties were built on the site of the Gaiety Theatre some time between 1890 & 1907 as the appear on the 1907 map.

 

14213.jpg

 

14143.jpg

 

In the lower photo the building on the right with the snazzy shop window is part of the garage

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I wonder..........

 

Algy on the news page today it says that painting from Warrington Museum are now all online for the first time on the BBC's website and it gives a link .

 

I have just had a look and there are many wonderful old paintings on there not only from the museum but also the Town Hall and other local and national establishments.

 

Anyway in the museums collection there are two of Sankey Street in 1904 and 1906.

 

Here's my 'wonder' (although I can't quite get my bearings) but do you think the brightly coloured building on this one by Thomas Hesketh could be the Gaiety Theatre? Seems a bit odd to have a building covered in paintings of people etc along that road considering the other buildings.... it certainly looks to have some sort of theatrical/happy feel about it.

 

TAKE NOTE OF THE AREA BEHIND THE 'THEATRE' WHICH LOOKS LIKE A GARDEN AND THEN THE BUILDING BEHIND THAT WITH THE LITTLE WHITE WINDOW.... you will see why later....

 

Have a look here at this one from 1904 which shows the colourful building (ps the images are all copyright hence me posting the direct link)

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/arts/yourpaintings/paintings/sankey-street-looking-from-the-west-104041

 

then look at this one from 1906.... the 'garden' and the building with the little white window is still there but the brightly painted building 'theatre??' appears to have gone.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/arts/yourpaintings/paintings/sankey-street-104042

 

Do you think we have found the answer at long last :D:unsure:

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Could the Cameo cinema have morphed from the Gaiety. Just a thought. Can't really see it being at the far end of Sankey street, but what do I know?

 

Happy days

To start with Harry you do know a heck of a lot, very streetwise and a tremendous general knowledge of the town, regarding the Cameo morphing from the Gaiety certainly not impossible, personally I still favour the area by Dixon Street though, I have emailed the museum today, so we shall await their reply with baited breath!. :wink::D

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