Red Dave!

[observer]

Well Dave's off to a good start, after 13 years of Tory Bliar - a 5% cut in Ministers salaries; a freeze on top civil service pay and bonuses, and plans to reduce pay differentials in the public sector -

[safeway56]

Taking a small pay cut is easy peasy with a few million quid of your Dad's cash in the bank.

[harry hayes]

Think Tony Blair made deeper cuts in ministers pay, so nothing new.

The more I look at the concessions made to the LDs -particularly the human rights bit - the more depressed I get at the apparent wishy washy nature of our future. Has Dave sold his soul for the trappings of power?

 

Happy days - perhaps

[observer]

Good arguement for having the Country run by millionaires then Safe; although, wasn't Tory Tony a millionaire?! Be interested to learn what, if any, cuts were made by Tory Bliar - aside from costing money and lives on about three wars, didn't he employ an Army of "political" advisors implanted in the civil service and paid for by the tax-payer? Seems Dave has already discovered examples of "new" Labour's mickey mouse spending, and no doubt all will be revealed by the new audit Czar, in due course.

[harry hayes]

Just for the record, Tony cut the pay of his cabinet by 20%.

Personally, I don't begrudge ministers their money - it's the top echelons of local authority appointees who seem to be paid too much that annoy me.

 

Happy days

[Wireless]

to get the savings they need it will be cuts in pay for all public sector workers plus a rise in VAT. These small cuts in ministers pay are window dressing to make it seems they are 'sharing the pain' , the sheer scale of MPs pay and retainers make it insulting.

[Eagle]

So the concensus is that he shouldn't bother making cuts because it may make him popular, that would never do would it?

[Bazj]

Just for the record, Tony cut the pay of his cabinet by 20%.

 

and then increased allowances to cover it I think?

 

Probably also told them to claim what they could to make up their wages off the expenses gravy train

[wolfie]

Just for the record, Tony cut the pay of his cabinet by 20%.

 

and then increased allowances to cover it I think?

 

Probably also told them to claim what they could to make up their wages off the expenses gravy train

 

Think you'll find it was Maggie that did that

[observer]

Twas indeed started under Maggie, but like most things continued by Bliar - who is now a millionaire! I've no doubt Dave's socialism is early window dressing for the pain the rest of us are yet to experience, but they need to make us feel, in the words of boy George - "that we're all in it together"!

[harry hayes]

Agree that we are all in it together, but in what I ask?

 

Happy days

[observer]

The Brown stuff H - up to our necks; and boy George will be zooming round in it in a speed boat - so best keep your mouths closed!

[observer]

Interesting piece on Newsnight tonight, as to how the inevitable austerity measures are going to hit the middle classes hardest - wonder where this Tory core vote is going to go?!

[asperity]

Obvious really that the so called middle class (care to put a finger on where the middle class starts and finishes Obs?) will be hit hardest. The poor have no money (by definition) and the rich have no taxable income

[observer]

Your right, but the majority of these folk vote Tory!

[asperity]

Your right, but the majority of these folk vote Tory!

 

If that was the case then Call me Dave would have won by a landslide. The majority of the electorate didn't vote for anybody in particular.

[observer]

Not the majority of the electorate, a majority of the middle class!

[Wireless]

A rise in VAT, which is highly likely, will hit the poorest hardest.For those on minimum wage and fixed income spend a far higher percentage of their meagre money on food.MPs of course claim up to ?400 per month in food expenses.

 

Added to which raising the tax threshold to help the low paid and increasing the state pension by 2.5% will be wiped out by any VAT increase.

 

In pure cash terms the middle class will be hit hardest.But the poorest will be hit harder in terms of the percentage of their income.

[Eagle]

wireless, why don't you do the maths before you spout garbage..

 

Using round figures lets say ?8000 income ?6715 allowances & 20% tax. Tax paid ?257

 

With new proposed Tax Threshold ?8000 income ?10000 allowances ;No Tax.

 

 

Weekly increase Approx ?5

 

VAT rise of 2.5%

 

 

To lose that fiver in VAT increases the person in question would have to be spending ?200 on taxable items, now that is definitely a large percentage out of a gross income of ?153 /week.

[asperity]

Not the majority of the electorate, a majority of the middle class!

 

I don't know where you get these dodgy statistics from Obs. You can't even quantify who should be classed as middle class, never mind what their voting intentions are.

[Wireless]

wireless, why don't you do the maths before you spout garbage..

 

Using round figures lets say ?8000 income ?6715 allowances & 20% tax. Tax paid ?257

 

With new proposed Tax Threshold ?8000 income ?10000 allowances ;No Tax.

 

 

Weekly increase Approx ?5

 

VAT rise of 2.5%

 

 

To lose that fiver in VAT increases the person in question would have to be spending ?200 on taxable items, now that is definitely a large percentage out of a gross income of ?153 /week.

 

So only half the increase will be wiped out, leaving the less well off a couple of quid a week better off? Well, don't spend it all at once. I don't believe it really shows any commitment to the less well off when raising the tax threshold to ten grand disproportionately helps the better off.

[Eagle]

You haven't grasped it at all have you?

 

Your use of 'disproportionate' is quite apt apart from your assessment being diametrically opposite to the actuality.

 

Who would feel the tax change best, someone going from ?257 tax to Nil tax or someone going from ?2257 tax to ?2000? Or even someone going from ?20257 to ?20000?

[observer]

Asp; if they had accurate stats; you'd never get another election leaflet ever - as the Parties would merely address their known support - something they are trying to get to btw.

[Wireless]

You haven't grasped it at all have you?

 

Your use of 'disproportionate' is quite apt apart from your assessment being diametrically opposite to the actuality.

 

Who would feel the tax change best, someone going from ?257 tax to Nil tax or someone going from ?2257 tax to ?2000? Or even someone going from ?20257 to ?20000?

 

I doubt very much anyone would feel ?250 over the course of 12 months is going to make a great deal of difference, particularly if the bulk of that person's income is spent on items that will almost certainly be subject to a rise in VAT.Of the 17 billion it will cost to raise the tax threshold only around 1 billion will go to those on lowest incomes.

[Eagle]

So would you rather that the low earners got nothing to ensure that the people you are jealous of get nothing?