observer Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Seems most of Europe is now largely dependent on Russian gas; havn't noticed an increase in coal production or building of hydro-electric power stations to give us energy independence?! Perhaps our Governments will wait till our heating fails? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inky pete Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Can't build new coal fired power stations - greenhouse gases and all that. Can't build wind farms fast enough - the NIMBYs won't allow it. Can't build much more hydro - all the best sites are in National Parks. Tidal barrages? - wetlands and wading birds. Solar? - in this country???? Waste incinerators? - see wind farms. Lots of nice shiny new Nuke stations it is then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Can't really afford the nukes though, but our grand-kids are in debt for evrything else - so why not?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inky pete Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Why worry. They'll all be living on the moon and eating protein pills for breakfast by then. .........if they can tear themselves away from Facebook and Twitter long enough to invent anything! And since it was my grandparents generation who bequeathed to us the current problems of decommisioning reactors which were built without the slightest thought given to how they could be taken apart again, it seems only fair to send a few technical challenges of our own off down the river of time for future generations to solve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Hydro will not work, you loose to much power down the lines transporting it to where it is needed. The same with tidal good for Bristol no where else Coal fine Nuclear fine Wind farms no good for Birmingham and the south The only trouble with coal is you have to buy the coal from abroad so you are still dependent on other countries. And no you can not re-open the coal mines you could if they had been moth balled but not now they have been shut and flooded.to be independent on energy you have to go nuclear. but even on that you now have to depend on the French to biuld them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 We're standing on 1,000s of years supply of coal, which is now being mined in some areas from open-cast sites; but no doubt where viable, new pits can be opened - after all they'll want somewhere to bury all the radio-active waste from the nuke stations! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 New mines could be opened but its not as easy as you think Obs, The old mine were situated in the best (cheapest place to mine and get the coal out) and they have now flooded making new mining in the area very very expensive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Q. Will it be more "expensive" than being blackmailed by GazProm in the future?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 I don't know But that is why there are no new mines being opened, just how much are you prepaired to pay for your energy Obs and who will pay for the people that cannot afford to pay double or more than they do now, Any government would have to take that into account. Its easy to spout, its alot harder when you have to take the need of the whole population into account. We have enough old people dieing of cold without your uncosted solutions into account Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 "Uncosted" cos I havn't got access to the financial projections; but what we can project is a National dependency on other Countries (in this case Russia) for our energy requirements - Bulgaria, which realies solely on GazProm supply was denied any energy supply last winter. Austria, has built a 4 month gas storage capacity, ironically 30% built and owned by GazProm. It's called being prepared for all contigencies Kyje; rather than, in the liberal tradition, sleep-walking into future crisis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 How will you insure old people don't die of cold Obs or are going to bring in euthanasia so they wont be a problem. As you know many old people can not afford heating now. How much more are you willing to pay for energy so as to make us energy independent. give me a figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Are you blind or what? I 've just said "I havn't access to the figures"; I'm merely making a case for the priciple of energy independence, in order to assure heating for those old folk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 in order to assure heating for those old folk. They are struggling to pay now. Let me put it another way as you are struggling to understand. Would you yourself be willing to pay double or more on your energy bill each year if it ment the UK was energy self sufficient. Yes or No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Your premise is incorrect, as YOU dont KNOW that it would be more expensive, and neither have you considered such possibilities as increasing insulation to achieve energy reduction or the subsidising of energy costs - no, in a typical liberal way, you won't identify a situation until it hits you between the eyes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Obs You forget I work in the energy industry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 So that's why it's in a mess! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted June 14, 2009 Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 Getting back to the point,From what I can see and it is only a personal opiniun Obs is it is because of the Russian problem that after years of sitting on the fence this government is now biulding nuclear power stations. It looks like the first ones will be at Sizewell and Hinkley Point. Better late than never Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2009 A nice legacy for future generations in cost terms and risk - but that's another debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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