Cleopatra Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 Doesn't that work both ways? Although if it did forums would not exist. Yes it does but lead by example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted September 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 No comment !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 Good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 I see some group in America has won the right to put up posters on the New York subway stating that some Muslims are "Savages" because of the way they behave; issuing fatwas against people that incites their own crazies to carry them out, smashing up embassies and US interests at the drop of a hat.... The won the right through the supreme court which overturned and ban on their posters because of their rights under the constitution to freedom of speech.... Right or wrong; I reckon they have just made the New York subway a target for some fanatical suicide bombers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 Each to their own. But when violence and killing is the way to deal with "comments/opinions", imo there is something seriously wrong with any religion that follows that practise. A very sad situation, when religion causes so much conflict and suffering around the world, and yet people support it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 (edited) It is not the religion that causes the conflict. It's the antagonists that cause the fanatic adherents to respond with violence. Let's get it straight. There are countless millions of muslims living a peaceful life. The antagonists such as those who waved a red rag at them in the form of a disgusting, obscene film ( and now in france published charicature cartoons of the prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings upon him) even knowing of the unrest it caused in Denmark in 2005. so the hot blooded young adherents respond with the violence the antagonists were aiming to create. Then afterwards they <poop> themselves with fear and go into hiding. Amin! Edited September 21, 2012 by Dizzy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 It's illegal to convert from Islam in Egypt, their have been many cases of coptic Christian girls being kidnapped, and forced to marry Muslims had their identity card changed to Muslim, and because of the law cannot change it back to Christian. http://www.bikyamasr.com/73903/us-professor-says-coptic-girls-being-kidnapped-forced-into-servitude-in-egypt/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 Cleo, a simple question. Do you think it is right for Muslims to kill people because they think their prophet has been abused? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Well nobody is badgering you to become a muslim are they? You don't have to respect anyones belief in a religion but neither do you have to make the negative comments that annoy any believer, you have a right to your opinion, just keep them to yourself instead of spreading negativity about a religion you have no real understanding of. Is that too much to ask of anyone? I didn't say I'm being badgered into becoming a Muslim, and I'm glad that you agree that I don't have to respect anyone else's belief in, well, anything. Respecting any individual is a different matter altogether, and one which I can usually subscribe to quite happily. This bit though - you have a right to your opinion, just keep them to yourself - worries me a little bit. I'm reminded of regimes like Stalin, Hitler, Herod, Pol Pot, Khomeini, and a whole raft of other despotic nutters who decree: think what you like but keep your gob shut or you'll die. I've not singled out any particular religion because I feel pretty much the same about any and all of them in the sense that they're all a mechanism of social, behavioural and, in some cases, political control. I'll have no truck with them whatever their colours. In respect of recent events, I'm more likely to be won over by political reasoning rather than religious hoodwinking, like here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/sep/18/violent-protests-blowback-us-intervention Whatever the faith is, if it can't accommodate somebody like Dawkins without issuing a contract on his life, then that isn't a faith, it's just a bully. It's bullied its adherents into thinking the way they should do. Almost the last word to Rushdie: ""The imagination only works when it's free, there's no way of dreaming in chains… It's very important that we be allowed the freedom of our own human nature." http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/features/the-week-in-radio-story-of-a-good-sport-has-lots-of-animal-magnetism-8157372.html?origin=internalSearch And the very last word to beaky, or at least the answers to his damn fine question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Cleo, a simple question. Do you think it is right for Muslims to kill people because they think their prophet has been abused? Do you and the other two know what Amin means? (Clue, it's the same as Amen). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Sid Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 I was given the advice many many years ago that you should never mock another persons religion and to the best of my knowledge I have managed to stick by it. Was also given the same advice about a persons politics and to a lesser extent choice of football team. For some reason known only to the people concerned these three seem almost interchangeable in that respect. Whatever religion a person believes in or has faith in cannot be changed short of drastic mental surgery and remember that not all people who are religious hold the same view of their religions as others. There are fanatics in all religions and they are to be tolerated and maybe pitied but to incite them is to breed more fanaticism. As for me and my god (fred by name) we go and hope for more understanding of life, the universe and belly button fluff 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Cleo, a simple question. Do you think it is right for Muslims to kill people because they think their prophet has been abused? Amin/Amen literally means 'so be it' which suggests that your answer to the question is 'yes' would you confirm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 A very good post Evil Sod. If you ever find the answer to belly button fluff and why it only affects males will you let us know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 No. To the creator God be glory for ever, Amen or truly. That is the correct way to use this word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safeway60 Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 If Monty Python's *Life Of Brian* was released 600 years ago the church wouldn't be able to find enough ways of putting the producers to a slow painful death. Islam is a modern religion and by comparison to Christianity is still in the dark ages...Only by education and enlightenment will they be able to express opinions of their own without fear of a Fatwah. I can stand on a street corrner and call Jesus and God all the names under the Sun without somebody wanting to slice off my head. One day Muslims will be able to do the same about their own prophet and Allah. It's called freedom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 No. To the creator God be glory for ever, Amen or truly. That is the correct way to use this word. I disagree, is that allowed on here? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Yes it is, and I disagree too. Not with you, but with the idea that there is only one "correct" way to use the word "amen". The literary definition is, as you said, "so be it". The ecclesiastical definition is "I believe it will be so". None of these are the wrong way to use the word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 I disagree, is that allowed on here? No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Yes it is, and I disagree too. Not with you, but with the idea that there is only one "correct" way to use the word "amen". The literary definition is, as you said, "so be it". The ecclesiastical definition is "I believe it will be so". None of these are the wrong way to use the word. Disagree all you want, it doesn't change anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Many Jews, Christians, Muslims, agnostics, and atheists are unaware of the true meaning of Amen. Most people believe that Amen means “So be it.” The Hebrew definition of Amen has more specific connotations meaning truth, firmness, verily and true. Egyptologists have been able to decipher hieroglyphics carved into temple walls, pyramids, and tombs that brings new knowledge to the God Amen. As many as 13 pharaohs used Amen or Amon in their throne names as far back as 2,000 BCE. The Hebrew definition of Amen upholds the most revered attribute of the Egyptian God, which is Truth. More importantly, in the Bible, Revelation 3:13, 14, Jesus Christ proclaimed Amen is: “the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God.” 1063 In the book of the prophet Isaiah, we find the expression “God of truth” (literally “God of the Amen”), that is, the God who is faithful to his promises: “He who blesses himself in the land shall bless himself by the God of truth [amen].” Our Lord often used the word “Amen,” sometimes repeated, to emphasize the trustworthiness of his teaching, his authority founded on God’s truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Disagree all you want, it doesn't change anything. We realise that, the lady is not for changing even when flowing against the tide, something that I have experienced. Something occurred to me as I was reading the Amen discussion, why is your Forum persona an incestuous Greek bird? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Many people are unaware of the true meaning and origins of the word "bunkum": http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=bunkum You can pontificate about semantics and etymology until the cows come home - and all words change over time - but the OED defines "amen" as "so be it". So, in the 21st century, in England and speaking English, that's what it means, 'cos that's what the rule book says. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
algy Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 I am now going to demonstrate my ignorance of religion, it always has been and always will be an important part of our family life but only in a basic and casual way, I have often heard grown hard men openly state that they do not believe in a God however when they are faced with the possibility of losing a loved one the first thing they very often do is pray to their God for help and if their prayers are not answered in the way that makes them happy or relieved the first thing they do is to curse that same God., this is the part where I show my ignorance of religion, I was always under the impression that 'Amen' was the end or finality of a prayer or Hymn, just goes to show that even at my age I'm still learning, however could you please agree on what the word means then I shall really have learned something new!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 Amen means verily verily or truth. Your Jesus often used it at the begining of one of his speeches (verily verily [or truly] I say unto you but using the hebrew Amen) and not at the end and if anyone wants to read his bible (that is if he even possesses one and I really don't believe an agnostic would have one in his house) he will see that for himself. But some people don't like to see the truth because then they would have to admit that they were wrong and climb down. Because many people think that amen means 'so be it' doesnt make it correct. You need to go back to when Amen was first used to understand it's correct meaning. anyone not willing to do that and prefer to believe it's incorrect meaning it is entirely entitled to, it's upto themselves and no matter how much they insist I am wrong I shall remain correct. Amin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 We realise that, the lady is not for changing even when flowing against the tide, something that I have experienced. Something occurred to me as I was reading the Amen discussion, why is your Forum persona an incestuous Greek bird? One wonders why you are nit-picking again beaky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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