Evil Sid Posted July 2, 2012 Report Share Posted July 2, 2012 easy pay them the same wage as the politicians Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Tessla Posted July 2, 2012 Report Share Posted July 2, 2012 The important thing is to get the political parties out of the equation. To change the subject slightly, I see in today's news we have a Labour party chap standing for election to be the new police commissioner. No doubt we will have a Tory and a Lib Dem too. That means people who vote (if many do) will vote on party lines. We want a police commissioner independent of all political parties - And if they're not backed by political parties then who are they going to be backed by in their campaigns - "businessmen" with dodgy pasts and thriving "pharmaceutical" import businesses , for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted July 2, 2012 Report Share Posted July 2, 2012 And if they're not backed by political parties then who are they going to be backed by in their campaigns - "businessmen" with dodgy pasts and thriving "pharmaceutical" import businesses , for example. oh you lefties make me laugh.... you always have to assume that anyone who doesn't work in the public sector and live in a council house with three generations of their families are somehow corrupt and in it for them selves.... not every businessman is corrupt Nick and not all are like Bradley Hardacre.... however not every worker wants to work to earn their money either in my experience! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted July 3, 2012 Report Share Posted July 3, 2012 Why do they have to be backed up by anyone? We should get away from costly election campaigns because that only favours the rich - whether big business or big trade unions. A free service should be established where anyone who can persuade a given number of people to nominate them can put themselves forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2012 OR, for this purpose, just do it by "selection" as with a Jury, which should answer your concerns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Tessla Posted July 3, 2012 Report Share Posted July 3, 2012 oh you lefties make me laugh.... you always have to assume that anyone who doesn't work in the public sector and live in a council house with three generations of their families are somehow corrupt and in it for them selves.... not every businessman is corrupt Nick and not all are like Bradley Hardacre.... however not every worker wants to work to earn their money either in my experience! it happens). I'm a homeowner and i do not work in the public sector (did once for a short period, found their attitude stank) I accept that not all businessmeen are corrupt but what would lead a businessman (who quite rightly has his eye on the bottom line, no taxpayer to bail him out) to back a candidate if he didn't expect something in return? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Tessla Posted July 3, 2012 Report Share Posted July 3, 2012 Why do they have to be backed up by anyone? We should get away from costly election campaigns because that only favours the rich - whether big business or big trade unions. A free service should be established where anyone who can persuade a given number of people to nominate them can put themselves forward. And how would the electorate know who to choose from the resulting list of candidates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2012 Nick, since when has the private sector NOT been bailed out by the taxpayer - what about the Banks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted July 4, 2012 Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 And how would the electorate know who to choose from the resulting list of candidates? Well, obviously, the people on the list would give details of themselves, restricted to a given number of words. This need not be a costly exercise - in fact it needn't cost the candidate anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 Doesn't really work Egg; it's like these shareholder and Union votes etc; generally, folk can't be bothered reading a thumb nail CV and manifesto; so don't vote. I'll be surprised if many bother to vote for the new Police Commissoners, just the usual tribal vote from the Party faithfull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted July 4, 2012 Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 I can't wait for the vote on the EU referendum.....I'll be knocking on the polling station doors at 6am for that one (If it ever happens.... which it should if Germany gets its way for closer political union..... and noot just in Britain either) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Baz he's just pandering to the Tory right, you don't think your going to get a vote yet do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Doesn't really work Egg; it's like these shareholder and Union votes etc; generally, folk can't be bothered reading a thumb nail CV and manifesto; so don't vote. I'll be surprised if many bother to vote for the new Police Commissoners, just the usual tribal vote from the Party faithfull. Precisely Obs - that's what I'm trying to get away from. The tribal vote. I accept most people wouldn't vote under the system I am suggesting. Most people don't vote anyway - while that might be regretable it doesn't really matter. What matters is that an elected upper house should not be elected by the same people as the lower house. I still think the "accident of birth" method is the best. If you are prejudiced against the aristocracy (if you find it, that is) and won't go for lottery winners, perhaps something on the lines of the jury selection procedure is the only way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Baz he's just pandering to the Tory right, you don't think your going to get a vote yet do you? It will happen if Germany push for a closer union and it will happen in may other countries too..... But surely if being in the EU is so great, they will be able to make a strong case for membership and there will be an overwhelming vote in favour..... or don't you think that will happen Kije? You are the one banging on about House of Lords reform in the other thread and yet you are quite happy to have a bunch of politicians give away our country because you don't trust the people to give you the verdict you want.... That's why the EU has refused to accept the no votes in three or four other countries in the past; they are scared of people power and think they know better.... democratic my arse! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Problem is Baz, when push comes to shove and "ordinary folk" are allowed "a choice"; they'll have that much propaganda thrown at them by the EU interests, that they'll probably blink first. Just look at the Irish referendas and the Greek second election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horace Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 So, is this an argument for "ordinary folk" not being given a choice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 I take it propaganda is anything Obs does not like , The trouble is Obs you have had propaganda thrown at you and believed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 And you don't believe the EUSSR propaganda do you Lt Kije Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 No Kije; I've observed events and formed my own opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Get real Obs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 No Kije; I've observed events and formed my own opinions. Don't forget though obs, "free thinking" isn't allowed in the Lib-Dem party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 If your trying to say you are free thinker Peter, may a suggest you try the stage, as that is the funniest thing I have heard in a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted July 5, 2012 Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 So should the plebs be allowed a vote on EU membership Kije? or are we all to thick to "understand the benefits"??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted July 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2012 Seems he thinks we're all too thick to observe events and form opinions of our own, without the help of the Guardian! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wahl Posted July 7, 2012 Report Share Posted July 7, 2012 reform of House ofLords is a waste of time and money. only idiots like clegg want this . far more important issues need sorting out human rights, ue, immigration and deportation etc. next waste of money is the stupid idea of police commissioners even thouhgh it is better than the jobsworthies on the current shambolic well paying police authority one day politicians will actually do something useful 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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