Nick Tessla Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 According to a report on the W********n G******n website, "Housing authority" Plus Dane has been given £560K to set up eight new pitches for travellers in Warrington. This is part of a £60m government programme. Disgraceful - and what sort of "pitch" costs £70k to set up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Carefull in criticising "travellers", you may be accused of "racism"! Perhaps this is a attempt to cure the housing shortage, without building any actual houses?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stallard12 Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 I've been gone almost forty years, so I'm a little confused about 'travellers'. I think they are akin to gypsies, but how did they become so powerful? Apparently they pay no taxes, they don't work and contribute nothing to society,so why are people bending over backwards to accomodate them? Can they work voodoo on ya or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 I've been gone almost forty years, so I'm a little confused about 'travellers'. I think they are akin to gypsies, but how did they become so powerful? Apparently they pay no taxes, they don't work and contribute nothing to society,so why are people bending over backwards to accomodate them? Can they work voodoo on ya or something? They now have the European Court of Human Rights to pander to their every wish and queues of solicitors and help groups all funded by legal aid (taxpayer) and the European superstate and supported by various lefty groups which think they should have equal rights.... beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Still not sure if you are in favour of the new pitches or against Baz. :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Where are these 8 new pitches going to be and yes £70k per traveler caravan pitch sounds a massive amount considering developers could build actual houses for less than that for the more deserving. Out of interest how many legal traveller type sites and pitches do we have in Warrington at the moment and where are they? How many does they government think we should have and why ? I know about the long standing 'temporary' site at Walton near the canal and Walton Arms pub and the one at Grappenhall which was allowed on green belt land but are there any others anywhere and are there any in the more deprived and run down areas of the town. Just wondered as it seems to me that travellers seem very careful and specicfic about where they want to lay their roots once they decide to become 'static' travellers ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Try Gorsey Lane for starters Diz; next to the railway bridge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RingoDave Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Perhaps it's just me. I new a number of "travellers" when I was growing up and got on well with the vast majority. These days, it seems that most want permanent sites, but not pay anything towards the community which they will be, physically, a part of. How do the "powers that be" define who is, in this manner, exempt from taxes, community charge, National Insurance....etc.? I would like to claim the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 There's a newish one just before the Daresbury Hotel. The lane on the left, where the old road joins the drag. It goes by the name of stables but there are a few caravans on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 According to this list Local authority traveller sites There aren't any official or unofficial sites in Warrington, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wireboy Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 I don't live too far from the Gorsey Lane site and I have never heard of any problems or incidents there. (not saying there has not been) I do however feel uncomfortable with local authority's now effectively being forced to find suitable sites for travellers. I am off the opinion where if travellers wish to become settled in one area then they should integrate with the local community and pay rates like everyone else. Also I fear areas will turn on other areas as they all argue amongst themselves where these sites are going. I'm sure plenty off NIMBY's will come out of the woodwork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 Wireboy.... I would be a total nimby on this subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wireboy Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 Baz. I agree with you. Why we are even tolerating this community angers me. Maybe the real reason for all of this is so the government can finally tie these people down and stop them from "travelling" into parks etc and if they get them to settle maybe get them to pay tax. Understandable people turning to NIMBY's but like I said they will go somewhere. I only fear some more affluent areas of towns will push the travellers to the less affluent areas. They won't be placed in a distant field somewhere, they will go on the local park or playing field or some natural beauty spot. Causing even more resentment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 A permanent static address would surely leave these "travellers" open to actually paying rates etc; perhaps that's why they need to keep moving?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Apparantly most if not all of the travellers have homes in Ireland, which are kept locked for most of the year while the owners 'work' in England. The travellers only return home for Christenings, and Christmas Basildon council are attempting to take possession of these homes to help pay for the costs involved in evicting travellers from Dale farm. What poetic justice it would be if squatters were to take over those empty properties Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodk Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I am not sure how this "tax excemption" works. If a traveller :- Buys something from a shop, they pay added tax Buys petrol from a garage, they pay VAT and fuel duty Runs a car they pay a Vehicle Excise License Buys cigarettes then they pay the duty on these Lives in one of these provided sites then pays rent and council tax Is subject to income tax, just like the rest of us here is a link to some Gypsy "Myths and facts" :- http://www.flintshire.gov.uk/wps/wcm/connect/378a450043bbef959be4ffefe5ba3caf/Gypsies%26+Travellers+English.pdf?MOD=AJPERES Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Obviously written by a Gypsy. •Buys petrol from a garage, they pay VAT and fuel duty - not on red diesel •Runs a car they pay a Vehicle Excise License - no they don't •Buys cigarettes then they pay the duty on these - again no •Lives in one of these provided sites then pays rent and council tax - what about the unauthorised sites •Is subject to income tax, just like the rest of us - now you are having a laugh. Since when do you pay income tax on 'cash in hand' As for breaking the law, by the time the summons arrives they have moved on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 plus Council Tax - no way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Now I would never have guessed that Rod would have stuck up for travellers :wink: ..... lets hope when they come parking on your car park Rod, you continue to show such benevolence.... after all, they were trying to buy that place not far from you near Fordton at one time.... Better keep your gates locked!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I'm sure on authorised sites they must either have to pay council tax or the owner pay business rates and collect rent of each unit. I know on caravan parks (static and permanent toursers) you have to vacate your static unit or remove your tourer for a certain amount of weeks each year (usually the site shuts down) so as not to pay council tax but that is merely so you are not liable to pay twice BUT I think you also have to you show you have a permenant home too where you DO pay council tax. In addition on such sites the site owner will have to probably pay business rates which would/could compensate for council tax I guess. Maybe permenant traveller sites work in the same way As for the rest then surely there has to be a distinction between the travellers who just move around and appear from time to time and leave a trail of destruction behind them against the more settled ones so maybe what RodK said must be right in a way. I know that many of those from the large and long standing Walton site round here certainly have car tax on their vehicles and also buy their cigs and food stuffs in the local shop where I go and they also use the same petrol station as I do so they are indeed paying the same taxes as me and others in that respect. Maybe they could be using red diesel too but you don't buy that on a garage forecourt but I guess they could buy it and store it in their own tanks on site under the pretence that it is for their heating and top up from that every now an again They would be in trouble if they were caught using it on a stop check though. As for cash in hand jobs... well there are probably a lot of people in many trades doing just that so it's not just a traveller/gypsy issue and part of me wishes that I could work like that In reality how can we blame travellers for living and working as they do as surely it's the fault of government legislation and of course the pc and human rights brigade as they are the ones who continue to allow them to do it !! Little polite rant over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Suggest you ask someone who's actually tried collecting/registering these folk for Council Tax! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Ok... give me their name, email address or phone number and I will Don't the council just send in their appointed big boy bailiffs like they do with normal businesses or homeowners who don't pay or fall behind on their council tax/business rate payments even if they are genuinely struggling to pay? I guess I just probably answered my own question there and they do indeed just go for the easy targets who roll over and eventually bow down and pay the surplus charges etc eh which probably compensate for the others who simply 'wont'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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