Have your say on Local Transport

[Dizzy]

Got something to say about Warringtons Public Transport... now's your chance ... well untill 17 December that is.

 

http://www.warrington.gov.uk/News/2010/November/transport_in_Warrington.aspx#0

 

How come I only every find out about these public consulatations when I come across them by accident or Gary puts them on the news page.......

 

http://www.warrington-worldwide.co.uk/articles/9335/1/Help-shape-towns-transport-policies/Page1.html

 

Makes me wonder how many 1000's of local people never actually realise they are 'being' consulted ... not everyone are internet junkies like us

[wahl]

I agree with Dizzy.

All should respond to the invitation to totally destroy LTP3. It once again places cyclists and pedestrians above every other transport medium.

Now is the time to force the poliutiocians and traffic mis managers to manage roaqd trans[ort as a priority - better roads, less traffic lights, fewer road obstructions, more safety education in schools and better management of valuable road space.

The last remnants of LTP 2 can be seen in the destruction of grass, bushes and tranquility and its replacement with miles of useless tarmac so thaqt the invisible millions of cyclists cand get off roads.

 

I shall be commenting so why not every reader?

a

[AdrianR]

I already have. No mention of new runcorn bridge yet massive effect this will have on Warrington if tolled (highly likley and likley to be big tolls to pay for it). Too cyclist pedestrian centric. Critical of lack of bus compention (from a council who owns the bus co!!) and wants to reduce car use into Warrington but admits no plans for cross town (avoiding centre) bus services!!

 

Interesting no plans for con charge but they want to control car use by using parking charges. They compare the prices in warrinton to Liverpool and Manchester. Er they are city's we are a town. Fails to mention the free - parking at the trafford centre, cheshire oaks (soon to get huge M+S) and other local centres (widness/ st helens / runcorn). Do they intend to price people out of warrington?

 

Rail gets little or no mention (now irrelevant for south of the river) as they admit they cannot control it.

 

All in all a disappointing effort lacking clear vision or indeed understanding.

[inky pete]

I thought pretty much all of the above.

 

No concrete suggestions.

 

Fails to take account of developments outside the area.

 

Ignores the "difficult" problems completely and concentrates on fanny-ing about around the edges.

 

Far too minority centric with loads of resources throw at just 500 extra cyclists across the whole borough, but none for the many thousands of extra drivers.

 

Far to concerned with being PC and ticking Green boxes.

 

No recognition of past failures.

 

Ignores the implications of the very statistics and research it quotes.

 

No opportunity in the "consultation" for real and workable ideas to be contributed.

 

......and can anyone tell me why taxis are suddenly considered to be public transport? They are run solely for the profit of their owners - not as a public service - and spend a significant portion of their time moving from one pick up to another with no passengers on board - thus producing MORE congestion and pollution than private cars.

[Bill]

Taxis (hackney) have always been classed as public transport because the council licences them specifically for that purpose. If they are empty, the For Hire light will be on, meaning the public can request them to stop and pick them up anywhere on the streets.

 

Private hire vehicles can't do this because they're not classed as public transport.

 

Bill

[inky pete]

Mind telling the council that?

 

They are classing both hackney and private hire cars as public transport.

 

And even if a hackney has its light on while empty - and they don't always, the driver might be on HIS commute to or from his chosen work area, or might be on his way back to the airport for example if he's based himself there (ever tried flagging one of those down? they're way too keen to get back to the terminals and pick up a really lucrative fair!) - whatever the reason they still spend a significant amount of their time taking up road space and producing pollution to no good effect. Not exactly Green in the way that other public transport is protrayed as being the Green option.

[Bill]

"Ever tried flagging one of them down?"

But that's council rules again Pete, they determine the region that the vehicles are allowed to pick up in, which to some extent does make sense.

 

If you want daft though in the taxi trade, why in an era of automated dispatching methods designed primarily to minimise ?dead? mileage, do so many councils demand that all vehicles return to their base empty on completion of a job? Even when the environmental issues are spelled out to them they just ignore the logic and mindlessly demand that drivers follow their outdated rule book.

 

The sooner they get rid of some of the local licensing numpties and come up with a set of unified rules governing the whole of the taxi trade the better it will be for everyone.

 

Anyway, don't want to turn this thread into another boring taxi saga so I'll say no more!

 

Bill

[Dizzy]

As pointed out by A Rowland on the news page....

 

This latest Local Tranport Plan (LTP 3) covers the period 2011 to 2030. The past two have covered a 5 year period but this one is a 19 year plan Why's that.

 

Also like AR says there is apparently no mention of the Mersey Gateway either.

 

I imagine that most people who see the words 'Consultation and Local Transport' will just presume it's all about bus timetables so wont even bother looking or commenting.

 

Five years ago that's what I would have thought anyway

 

Anyway off to read it all now and comment accordingly

[Peter T]

I think 2030 is the end of Warrington. Everything is geared up for that year.

[Dizzy]

Can it not get brought forward

[Dizzy]

Seems you are right Peter everything is geared towards 2030. But what happens when leadership changes or ideas/needs change are we stuck with it all or will it all be scrapped

 

This is taken form the Warrington & Co website.... made me smile

 

By 2030, Warrington will be recognised as one of the best places to live and work in the UK, where everyone enjoys an outstanding quality of life.

 

This is the long-term vision for the borough, as set out in the Sustainable Community Strategy - One Warrington: One Future. Developed with and shared by all partners, this vision is simple, ambitious and lies at the heart of the regeneration framework for Warrington

 

 

Anyway back to the Local Transport Plan consultation .............

[Peter T]

Can it not get brought forward

 

In the meantime, what is there for people over the next 20 years when we have increasing numbers of people retired who will no doubt be wanting to use their cars etc etc and reducing services. It must all make sense to someone, but who?

The green flag department??????

[wahl]

Another thing

 

this mess of a plan will be managed by the local quango with its members of useless political brain dead scroungers.

 

vote them all out especially those who have been in local politics for more than 6 years as they have no doubt been tainted from the aftermath of the corrupt government under gordon g

[AdrianR]

Nothing will happen anyway. looking at the last two LTP's we still havent got chapelford station, still havent got specific bus corridors, no cross town busses avoiding the town (mentioned in latest proposed LTP but no mention as to how they'll fix it) and still no bypass / alternative mersey crossing.

 

Out of intetrest if the council achieves the LTP and reduces congestion they get more money. Halton i believe got some last time but w/ton missed out.

 

I think however the Mersey Gateway issue will be the main problem in this period. I hear there is a funding isssue with it which can only be made up by tolls. Whilst it is agreed that it will proceed, how much HMG are going to contrbute isnt agreed.

 

Warrington are unlikley to get a sniff of any money and even if they do they'll probably sepnd it on bike lanes rather than aleviating the traffic which by avoiding the gateway will neither originate in or stop in Warrington.

 

In the last LTP it was recorded that 50% of people living in Warrington didnt work in Warrington. Also 50% working in Warrington didnt live there!

 

Thats a lot of movements not related to Warrington and yet the new LTP doesnt recognise this.

[tara_dad]

dont get in a pink taxi as they are not .......lol

[wolfie]

not what ..............???

[disgusted]

not what ..............???

.....Relevant to this thread, but Taras_dad only has one topic to discuss ever.

[Peter T]

 

 

 

In the last LTP it was recorded that 50% of people living in Warrington didnt work in Warrington. Also 50% working in Warrington didnt live there!

 

I'm stunned. I didn't think the council were aware of this.

[Bill]

New words maybe but it's the same old message.

 

The council?s figures show that 80% of households own cars and yet the number one listed objective is to reduce the need to travel by car. I?ve no objections to them wanting to better public services and provide alternatives but setting it out as their number one priority shows the same old entrenched position when it comes to car ownership and guarantees it?s just more of the same for the future.

 

Bill

[Bazj]

dont get in a pink taxi as they are not .......lol

 

I wouldn't get into any of the TD, not after seeing the bald tyres on a taxi next to me the other day

[Dizzy]

Tut Tut... don't they have to have regular checks to make sure they are safe and road legal cos they are a free community service now

 

Last one I saw was on the back of a recovery wagon though but I've not seen any others on the roads for ages.....thought they'd closed and moved onto other things

[Bazj]

Dizzy,

 

it is well known that a few taxi drivers have in the past gone and got their tests done (used to be at the bus depot where my friend worked..... inside knowledge!!) and then swapped wheels with the next taxi going in for a test.

 

I was told personally that that was the case even quite recently by a taxi driver who wanted the wheels off my Merc when he found out I was selling it. He was going to swap his wheels for mine until it was pointed out to him that 3 of his tyres were actually illegal!!

 

So I didn't swap!

[Dizzy]

Wonder how many other drivers do the same

 

Surely though if you only swap wheels and tyres to pass the mot then you swap them back again if you are stopped and found to have a newly issued mot with bald tyres it's a bit of a giveaway.

 

Could always blame ot on the garage though by just saying 'well these were on my car when it passed'.

 

The garage would have no real proof that they weren't and they could get struck off by VOSA

[tara_dad]

Back to the Taxi/PH they have two test a year by the department of transport and its the Council Taxi/ PH licensing department who are responsible to do spot checks when ever they like. plus if they go to other towns they are open to there councils stop checks. and as you know the police and customs and the department of transport do there own at any time.

if they are found to be unsafe in any way even down to not having the right signage they are taken off the road and they are reprimanded and if it happens again they can lose there licences.

 

But its looks also here as a member of the public did you report the matter to the council ? did you get the taxi number?. So may be its also the public fault as well for not report it as clearly shows things are not right.

[disgusted]

Just a reminder for those who havn't, fill in this survey, before lycra nutters like Rod King have the entire town pedestrianised!

 

One example I picked from page 27, under 'Managing Motorised Travel - Key Challenges'

"Break the link between

car/vehicle availability

and automatic choice of

this mode for journeys."

 

In other words, it is deliberate council policy to work towards stopping you even having the choice to use your own vehicle, the one you pay dearly for in purchase cost, running, and tax.

 

An absolute disgrace!