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Oy - as I have said, I am not crusading on either side, and I am certainly not defending WBC, because that lot even wanted to sell the building used by Lymm British Legion - can you get any lower than that?!

 

BUT if these documents you suggest do actually exist, then presumably Waltonian has options for posting facts on web pages and Forums instead of mysterious hints and sarcasm? Given his/her head start on the rest of us and self-proclaimed reserve of details unknown even to senior Council members, plus his/her devotion to the Hall, you'd think it was easier just to blast the truth out there, wouldn't you? Course, I can only speak for myself, :wink: but if I had one shred of proof WBC was out of line and the Hall was at risk, I'd share it in the interests of saving the place.

 

I'm going to poke about a bit more, and should I find anything, I'll post it. I'm not going to argue any more though. I think there's as much chance this was stirred up for the timely local politics as there is of the Council having a second and undeclared agenda.

 

It may all go away today if we've unelected enough LibDems! :lol:

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Oy - as I have said, I am not crusading on either side, and I am certainly not defending WBC, because that lot even wanted to sell the building used by Lymm British Legion - can you get any lower than that?! :lol:

 

I know you are not really crusading on either side LP neither am I. But for the record 'yes' they can get a lot lower than that.

 

Maybe I am just being a tad cynical or paranoid about the future of Walton Gardens but I guess that's my own fault for reading too many other 'secret' council documents in the past :D:wink:

 

You'll be just like me before you know it :lol:

 

Anyway the way I see it is that the only real issue here seems to be that of retaining ALL public access.

 

Even Waltonian's petition says

 

?I do not wish Warrington Borough Council to sell or lease any part of the existing Walton Hall parkland or gardens to a private company if it means that I am prevented from having free access to the grounds that I currently enjoy?

 

:wink:

 

However it would be very interesting to read exactly what state all the building are really in and if indeed they do require as much work and money as the council say they need (which they cant afford) to enable the whole estate to be managed and run properly without having to palm it off on private enterprise.

Eg are they crumbling, are they dangerous, are they in need of serious repair :wink::?

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[quote name="Peter T

Sha' date=' You are correct, but IF that was to happen, these threads would not get commented on. It is the 'light-hearted' posts that keep them going, and IF you read between the lines, you WILL find serious answers/posts. Check the number of responses on different threads. That tells how much people take notice and highlights people's concerns.[/quote]

 

Peter, I'll agree that the occasional 'light hearted' remark, thown into a discussion can keep the thread alive and interesting. But I think in this instance it just threw the thread completely off topic which was such a shame as it's a very important local issue and the original poster had obviously not just tuned in for a chat.

 

Probably the reason so many threads are going off topic in this way is because the regular posters are already so familiar with each others viewpoints that their replies are becoming increasingly predictable, whilst the jokey lines are not.

This doesn't however seem particularly encouraging to new posters.

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.......... I am not one to give WBC the benefit of any doubt on anything. If this does turn out to be dodgy, I will be standing beside you in the path of the bulldozers! :lol:

 

LymmParent,

I am certainly not one to give WBC the benefit of any doubt on anything! Not after seeing how they've operated on other projects!

 

So I am absolutely not going to believe whatever they say above what is said by the savewaltongardens group.

This group is closely linked to the Friends of Walton Hall, people who on a voluntary basis have worked damm hard for years in the interests of keeping Walton Hall for the public. For which I admire and am grateful to them and because of which I see no reason to doubt what they say.

 

... If Waltonian was here to communicate, why does the post not include the information he/she says that even senior councillors don't have, but he/she does? Why isn't that information on the website he/she links?

 

The fact that the Friends of Walton Hall and other senior councillors have not been 'in on the loop' and haven't been given all the relevant documents is the whole point. What they have managed to glean from various sources is extremely worrying, and the fact that WBC are also operating over this in much the same manner as they have done on other projects they've pushed through against public opinion adds to the concern.

 

If you think that this concern is unfounded and need to find more information for yourself, I suggest you start with Andrew Farrell WBC, who as he is dealing with this project must have all the answers/documents you need. Whether he will give them to you is another matter, but I think once you have spoken to him you will be a little clearer 'how the land lies'.!

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I'm not going to argue any more though. I think there's as much chance this was stirred up for the timely local politics as there is of the Council having a second and undeclared agenda.

It may all go away today if we've unelected enough LibDems! :lol:

 

Well if you're not going to argue anymore thats one thing to be thankful for! :lol:

 

On one point you are right LP, this was brought up at a timely point before the general elections. Though I think you may suspect others. If you notice It was me who started the other thread, just before the ballots went in. There was no party/political point scoring in this, merely the reasons I did this were;

 

Because I felt it would be somewhat devious of our local politicians to be with-holding any information on account of it might be detrimental to their political careers, and I wanted to know where all our politicians stood on this matter before I made my choice at the ballot box.

I have no political allegiance to any party, I don't support the leadership of this town but that is because of the particular type of leadership I feel we unfortunately have, I personally see it as more of a dictatorship. In fact, apart from the top few (who have been making all the decisions) I think there are some good councillor's in all of the political party groups. So my actions were not motivated by party politics just merely to find out who stood where on a local issue.

As it was an important issue, and immediately prior to the election I expected there would be some response.

There was, Ian Marks statement, disapointingly evasive and misleading.

Whilst none of the other parties made any statement/comments.

 

My conclusion from this on the matter of Walton Hall;

Think we should prepare for one hell of a battle!

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One reads these posts with amusement.

One should never believe what the council say about how much things cost. They put a mark-up of about 3000% on every quote they make.

 

Repairing the glass-house would be a brilliant project for the Collegiate(oops University) Priestley and other places where they train people to be tradesman. They could even use the Community Payback scheme to help.

 

And as for talking to Andy Farrell, getting information from him, his boss and anyone else in the know, will be like getting blood out of a stone.

 

On the other hand, it is good management not to reveal your hand before everything is in place.

The mistake that this lot have made, is NOT consulting and NOT stating what safeguards will be part of any agreement made that include the public interest.

 

As for making light of serious topics, that is how things happen. IF you can come up with a better system than the one on here, let us know. Every new poster anywhere, has to learn the language and adopt a thick skin. Some adapt quicker than others, don't they LP?

 

Sha,

One awaits your ideas re. a better way of doing things. :wink:

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And as for talking to Andy Farrell, getting information from him, his boss and anyone else in the know, will be like getting blood out of a stone.

:wink:

 

Why do you think I put LP on the case!

If anyone can get his back to the wall and drag info out of him, it'll be LP!!!

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Goodness, Sha, for someone so keen on polite posting and so quick to criticise the impolite a moment ago, you're getting quite near the edge now.

 

Sha, go and shout at someone else, please. I am sick of you making me out to be some sort of champion for WBC, when nothing is further from the truth. I am not interested in anything except restoring and protecting Walton Hall and Gardens. If that means I have to set aside my distaste for WBC's usual conduct long enough to hear the facts, I am willing to do so.

 

All I have said to date is that it is worth at least considering a ?20M rescue package that is on offer before dismissing it and leaving the Hall to take its chances in a time of public spending cuts. I cannot see how that view can possibly offend anyone with a genuine desire to see the Hall saved.

 

If you want to send Contesa packing, along with all their money, because someone says that someone's heard something that worried them, then I respect your right to say so. If you are going to let your dislike of the Council close your mind to anything positive about the idea before you've even heard it, then so be it. If the majority agree with you, then I resign myself to seeing the whole estate sink slowly into the grass. At least you'll ensure I can get in to watch it happen, I suppose! :lol:

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On the other hand, it is good management not to reveal your hand before everything is in place.

The mistake that this lot have made, is NOT consulting and NOT stating what safeguards will be part of any agreement made that include the public interest.

 

Yes, I'd like have seen a better statement than just "Public access will be safeguarded". I'd like to have seen the invitation actually say that preserving and hopefully extending current levels of public access must form the basis of any proposal.

 

I shall get out my winkle pin and see what Andy Farrell says next week. I'm sure he will be a model of helpfulness. Eventually. :wink:

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Goodness, Sha, for someone so keen on polite posting and so quick to criticise the impolite a moment ago, you're getting quite near the edge now.

 

Sha, go and shout at someone else, please. I am sick of you making me out to be some sort of champion for WBC, when nothing is further from the truth. I am not interested in anything except restoring and protecting Walton Hall and Gardens. If that means I have to set aside my distaste for WBC's usual conduct long enough to hear the facts, I am willing to do so.

 

All I have said to date is that it is worth at least considering a ?20M rescue package that is on offer before dismissing it and leaving the Hall to take its chances in a time of public spending cuts. I cannot see how that view can possibly offend anyone with a genuine desire to see the Hall saved.

 

If you want to send Contesa packing, along with all their money, because someone says that someone's heard something that worried them, then I respect your right to say so. If you are going to let your dislike of the Council close your mind to anything positive about the idea before you've even heard it, then so be it. If the majority agree with you, then I resign myself to seeing the whole estate sink slowly into the grass. At least you'll ensure I can get in to watch it happen, I suppose! :lol:

 

Goodness, LymmParent, WHAT is all that about?

Where do you get the idea that I think you're some sort of champion for WBC?

Why do you think my post is impolite to you? It wasn't meant to be and I can't even work out which part of the post offended you!

 

My suggestion that you speak to Andrew Farrell was because I think if you did, perhaps you would be able to understand better why I (and others) hold the opinions we do.

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Why do you think I put LP on the case!

If anyone can get his back to the wall and drag info out of him, it'll be LP!!!

 

LP I recon that was actually a compliment from Sha :wink: I'd be happy if someone said that about me :D

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And as for talking to Andy Farrell, getting information from him, his boss and anyone else in the know, will be like getting blood out of a stone.

:wink:

 

Why do you think I put LP on the case!

If anyone can get his back to the wall and drag info out of him, it'll be LP!!!

 

THAT post, I took in the friendly spirit it was meant. The previous one was rather shouty, with various bold bits and I did not take it terribly well. I have no affection for WBC. Wouldn't trust them with a tube of Smarties. I live in Lymm, with half the village on the "for sale" list and no decent public toilets for decades. In terms of "how the land lies", round here most of it already lies under housing stock to generate Council Tax - and that includes green belt land, lost green spaces AND the Old Mill at Heatley, which rotted to the point of being condemned and was lost forever, because a proposal to preserve it if permission was granted for some office buildings in the grounds too was shot down.....

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Not good is it LP but alas it appears to be the same everywhere in Warrington.

 

Just like with the lack of majority over the general election results, locally it seems there are similar chats now going on to see who can 'collide the nicest' with a.n.other to take overall control :roll:

 

At least Lymm kep Bob Barr.. you must be pleased about that :wink:

 

Anyway there are other topics to discuss all that on. :wink:

 

This one is about the worries and uncertanty regarding the future of Walton Hall, its gardens and lack of free public access etc.

 

Back on topic now eh :D:wink:

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Sha,

One awaits your ideas re. a better way of doing things.

:wink:

 

Peter, in your own words "......it is good management not to reveal your hand before everything is in place". :wink::lol:

 

Sha,

I hope that you haven't brought flippancy into the procedings? :shock::shock::shock:

the words cop out, spring to mind. :lol:

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No cop-out Peter, I have my own ideas on how the Estate could be run, without private investment, which I think is just the council's cop out ......sorry WAS..... the previous council's cop out for putting in any effort.

 

From your past posts I know that you are well aware of the way the (previous) council have worked, and the various ruses used to make private investment appear the only option. I know you have a strong interest in community issues and thus think maybe you, like myself, would like to see the estate providing as best community benefit as possible.

 

Like I said I have my own ideas on what and how these can be achieved. Some of which I will willingly discuss with you on this forum some I won't. (but depending on what you want the info for I may be willing to speak to you off the forum!)

 

So, on the forum, where do you want me to start?

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No cop-out Peter, I have my own ideas on how the Estate could be run, without private investment, which I think is just the council's cop out ......sorry WAS..... the previous council's cop out for putting in any effort.

 

From your past posts I know that you are well aware of the way the (previous) council have worked, and the various ruses used to make private investment appear the only option. I know you have a strong interest in community issues and thus think maybe you, like myself, would like to see the estate providing as best community benefit as possible.

 

Like I said I have my own ideas on what and how these can be achieved. Some of which I will willingly discuss with you on this forum some I won't. (but depending on what you want the info for I may be willing to speak to you off the forum!)

 

So, on the forum, where do you want me to start?

 

Not only intelligent but a people profiler as well.

Thank you, I will bear that in mind.

 

WHY is it that only the female posters have their finger on the pulse with issues like this?

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