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Too many traffic lights!!!!!


Gary
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sorry love, but have you never thought of moving to live NEAR (within walking distance) of your place of work? If teachers did that, we might keep the schools open in Winter! :roll:

 

Obs, I will put the above ridiculous statement down to the fact that it is nearly Christmas and you have been on the cooking sherry for a few hours, because no sober person would have come up with such nonsense.

 

Imagine the young girl who works for my wife who lives in Dallam and has to get to the other side of Stockton Heath every day.... how is she to afford a house or flat in such a posh area?

 

I think you are still stuck in your commy idyllic world matey. Maybe a visit to the real world now and then may help you understand modern life a bit better :wink:

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A trip to your "real" world, means you get stuck in traffic. :roll: There are Council and other rented properties south of the canal or she could try to get a job closer to where she lives - in either case reducing transport costs, and reducing the demand for road space - sorted. :wink:

 

I refer the honourable (?) gentleman (?) to my previous answer to his previous bit of nonsense

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Car culture yes.... because we have NO decent affordable public transport in this town or in this country. Successive governments have failed to put a fully integrated public transport policy in place because the cost is totally unaffordable (even more so now)

 

There is no way I will give up my car to have my families well being put in the hands of WBT and its maniac drivers and their excessive pricing structure

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Not "against" the "car" at all; merely facing a reality - that there are too many of them for the space available, hence congestion.
Sorry, can't agree. Warrington isn't particularly bad for traffic, it is the horrendous traffic management, like Asda lights, the (now defunct) bus lane outside Tesco, and traffic lights everywhere that is the cause of congestion. If there wasn;t this insistence on plonking a set of lights everywhere, we would have a much smoother flow around town.

 

 

We have also developed a dependency on them, and indeed an expectancy for mobility generally, which gets exposed in bad weather. :?
What gets exposed down here, is the bloody appaling driving standards in ropey weather. Sunday night being a case in point, I was heading for jct8, on the back road behind M&S, you know the one with the small incline to the lights?

 

Well, traffic at a standstill because two drivers (women of course) sat there on the upslope spinning their wheels like total martians.

 

Obviously the key they felt to driving in snow, especially going uphill, was to go as slowly as possible in first gear, with the shock result that they just sat there spinning their wheels. Drivers like that shouldn't be allowed out after dark imo.

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the (now defunct) bus lane outside Tesco

 

If it's now defunct then it no longer affects the traffic - so you can't claim it as a cause for current congestion.

 

And as for the complaints about Stockton Heath of late - as far as I can see there have not been any changes in the number of traffic lights for the past four or five years at least. So if that's the case, then what has suddenly caused the current outrage? Has road congestion gotten worse of late? If so, it must be down to some other factor specifically, be it more cars on the road, or the sheer size of vehicles on the road (less roadspace efficent), or simply worse driving standards.

 

Unfortunately, if you are stuck in your car in a queue, the bad news is that you are part of the problem - yes, you! The good news is that you were partly right - everyone else is to blame as well! 8)

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Don't disagree with that, but that's an arguement for the politicians - and none have delivered a fully integrated transport system; they can't even electrify the West Coast rail line or subsidise fares to tempt folk out of their cars. :shock:

 

Er - the West Coast line is electrified...

 

Politicians could subsidise fares. Until the Law Lords stuck their political noses in, and then Thatcher legislated to stop subsidies.

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JimmyMac,

Long time no see.

One of the problems with the St H lights was the delay to allow pedestrians to cross at the main junction. That certainly causes delays.

One thing that would speed movement at any junction with lights would be to allow traffic to turn right under the control of the light.

 

The timing of crossings need looking at as well. eg St. H swing bridge crossing. There can be no need for this to be stopping the flow of traffic for as long as it does. There aren't that many people crossing the road there. It just causes chaos at the Morrisons lights. (Greenalls Av, before someone corrects me)

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I don't believe I did? I gave it as an example of the horrendous traffic planning measures employed by the council.

 

Ok, but let's not reopen the old arguement about its perceived benefits and downsides else we'll be here all night. It's gone now, so would it be possible for car drivers to accept their victory with a little more grace and stop using it as a club to beat the council round the head with?

 

Peter - the fact is though that I don't believe anything has been altered with regards to traffic lights in Stockton Heath for the past few years, so this isn't a new problem - why is it raising its head again now? As someone who used to live in the village (and subsequently someone who worked there too), I don't think we should be ripping out pedestrian crossings all over the place. The fact is there's simply too much traffic trying to get through*: how "vibrant" will the village centre remain if it's made so much more difficult to cross the road?

 

And I take some umbrage with the idea that few people use the crossing by the swing bridge. It is either underused and therefore should have little effect on the traffic anyhow (as it will remain on green for most of the time) else it is fairly well used by pedestrians and cyclists coming from the Black Bear who need to cross over at this point.

 

I agree that a right-turn filter phase at Victoria Square would be of use for vehicles turning out of Grappenhall Rd onto London Road. Perhaps there should also be an official no-right-turn out of Walton Road too? And then remove the pedestrian crossing on the north side of those lights, in preference to taking the route via the south side or walking up to the lights opposite The Forge.

 

* And I principally blame the new upmarket housing developments in Appleton and Grappenhall Heys for that - maybe we need a supermarket up at Stretton...? :twisted:

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And I take some umbrage with the idea that few people use the crossing by the swing bridge. It is either underused and therefore should have little effect on the traffic anyhow (as it will remain on green for most of the time) else it is fairly well used by pedestrians and cyclists coming from the Black Bear who need to cross over at this point.

 

Not suggesting removing crossings. Just suggesting that the timing needs looking at. A centipede couild cross at the Black Bear xing, the length of time it takes to change. This then has a reverse domino affect to ALL the roads on either side of the canal.

 

 

* And I principally blame the new upmarket housing developments in Appleton and Grappenhall Heys for that - maybe we need a supermarket up at Stretton...? :twisted:

 

I dread to think what it will be like when the 600 plus houses are built on the old timber yard on Chester Rd and on the Greenalls sites.

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I'll agree that there are toooo many traffic lights, but there is also tooo many cars; plus tooo many new developments with contrived access/exits onto the main drags: EG: the Azda exit in Brick St; and the entrance to the GS CP from Midland Way. Takes eons to get out of Azda now the (part-time) lights are on at the Cockhedge Island. :twisted: Vic: so they've increased the height of all the bridges along the W/Coast route? :?

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Vic: so they've increased the height of all the bridges along the W/Coast route? :?

Sorry, I still don't understand what the issue is. They raised the bridges to fit the wires (or lowered the track) when it was first electrified. Last time I went to Bank Quay the London-Glasgow trains were electric.

 

 

And as for the complaints about Stockton Heath of late - as far as I can see there have not been any changes in the number of traffic lights for the past four or five years at least. So if that's the case, then what has suddenly caused the current outrage?

 

No new lights, but (in line with Council priority that puts pedestrian safety first) there's a pedestrian phase that takes half a minute. Maybe more pedestrians shopping at Christmas so operating on every cycle? Or maybe because those who normally take the diversion routes / rat runs are sticking to gritted roads.

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I don't believe I did? I gave it as an example of the horrendous traffic planning measures employed by the council.

 

Ok, but let's not reopen the old arguement about its perceived benefits and downsides else we'll be here all night. It's gone now, so would it be possible for car drivers to accept their victory with a little more grace and stop using it as a club to beat the council round the head with?

I wasn't beating anyone over the head with it, nor did I particularly go on about it when it was there.

 

However it was there long before the Asda lights, and the Calver road lights, yet the council still ploughs on making traffic management mistake after traffic management mistake.

 

I can't comment on sowf of da riva as I am rarely there, I just comment on the mistakes made on the northern half of town.

 

Look at their (now aborted) attempt to resurface Callands Road. They wanted to remove the chicanes which do work, and put in more speed cushions, which don't work, becasue this would apparently reduce speeds. :roll:

 

A cursory 10 minutes studying traffic on the orad would have confirmed that for them, yet we had to fight to stop them making the changes. They are so clueless they even deny the vehicle damage caused by these 'cushions', because apparently the laws of physics stop applying if you drive over them at 20mph! :roll::roll:

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"Last time I went to Bank Quay the London-Glasgow trains were electric. "

 

Not always. 6.22 to Euston is diesel despite being under the wires for the whole route. (joins up with another at crewe). Also the B'ham to Glasgow trains are diesel agsin despite beign under the wires all the way.

 

Has anyone got a comment on the planned ?3m changes to the Alban Retail Park/ Collegiate roundabout i.e. getting shut of it.

 

Sounds like a lot of money for a small job and again not convinced this will benefit this junction. The planners "believe" it will benefit. Doesnt sound to confident and their recent track record isnt good. However as they seem to be outside of anyones control dont expect we can do much.

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No new lights, but (in line with Council priority that puts pedestrian safety first) there's a pedestrian phase that takes half a minute.

 

 

YOU JEST!!!! What sort of Mickey Mouse watch did you use to time it?

 

Time it from when it goes on amber to when it goes to green. Then you might get a more realistic figure.

But whilst your at it, take into account the traffic from Greenhalls Av that double up on the yellows causing problems exiting Loushers and Gainsboro. :roll:

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No new lights, but (in line with Council priority that puts pedestrian safety first) there's a pedestrian phase that takes half a minute.

 

YOU JEST!!!! What sort of Mickey Mouse watch did you use to time it?

 

Time it from when it goes on amber to when it goes to green. Then you might get a more realistic figure.

But whilst your at it, take into account the traffic from Greenhalls Av that double up on the yellows causing problems exiting Loushers and Gainsboro. :roll:

 

I'm timing it from when the lights go green for the pedestrians, to when they next go to amber for road traffic. I'm not sure of the significance in this context of traffic that "double up on the yellows" - or what it means even!

 

 

Has anyone got a comment on the planned ?3m changes to the Alban Retail Park/ Collegiate roundabout i.e. getting shut of it.

Plans anywhere online?

 

I don't think it's been finally designed yet, but the summary of the modelling exercise is here: http://212.248.237.112/CmisWebPublic/Binary.ashx?Document=10366

 

It's essentially removing the roundabout, creating extra lanes for turns. There's no near equivalent junction in Warrington with the volumes from the minor roads, but I suppose Sankey Way/Cromwell Avenue is similar.

 

In terms of safety (particularly for pedestrians and cyclists) a signalised four-arm junction is better than a roundabout, and signalising any junction usually pays dividends (in reducing delays) where traffic volumes are high. Modelling and theory don't always work though....

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