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Thick Micks?


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Will the Irish prove it in their EU referendum? :?:roll:

 

I will treat this remark with the contempt it deserves :twisted::twisted:

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Given the result, I think that you might have to change your picture, Asperity. :wink::D

 

On a serious note, it really is quite disgraceful that the original NO vote was not accepted. It sets a dreadful precendent and makes a mockery of the democratic process.

 

With regards to the UK's position, I think the Conservatives should have in their manifesto a simple promise that they will hold a one off, never to be repeated, simple YES/NO referendum in their first Parliament on our continued membership of the EU. Conservative MPs would be free to vote/campaign as they wished. Indeed I would probably limit the timescale and finances of the campaign thereby basing the vote on people's gut feelings. The other plus point would be that it would largely kill off the UKIP vote. :wink:

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Six reasons for the "Yes" vote:

 

1) The intervention of the European Commission, entailing massive expenditure of money to influence Irish opinion towards a Yes, the running of a web-site and the issuing of statements that sought to counter No-side arguments, and the adocacy of a Yes vote by Commission President Barroso and other Commissioners and their staffs during visits to Ireland. This is unlawful under European law, as the Commission has no function in relation to the ratification of new Treaties, something that is exclusively a matter for the Member States under their own constitutional procedures;

 

2.) The part funding of the posters and press advertising of most of Ireland's Yes-side political parties by their sister parties in the European Parliament, even though it is illegal under Irish law to receive donations from sources outside the country in a referendum and even though, under European law, money provided by the European Parliament to cross-national political parties is supposed to be confined to informational-type material and to avoid partisan advocacy;

 

3) The Irish Government's unlawful use of public funds in circulating to voters a postcard with details of the so-called "assurances" of the European Council, followed by a brochure some time later containing a tendentious summary of the provisions of the Lisbon Treaty, as well as other material - steps that were in breach of the 1995 Irish Supreme Court judgement in McKenna that it is unconstitutional of the Government to use public funds to seek to obtain a particular result in a referendum;

 

4) The failure of the country's statutory Referendum Commission to carry out its function under the Referendum Act that established it of explaining to citizens how the proposed constitutional amendment and its text would affect the Irish Constitution. Instead the Commission's Chairman, Judge Frank Clarke, turned the Commission into an arm of Government propaganda, while the judge indulged himself in various "solo-runs" on radio and in the newspapers, giving several erroneous explanations of provisions of the Lisbon Treaty, even though this was quite beyond his powers under the Act;

 

5) Huge expenditure of money by private companies such as Intel and Ryanair to advocate a Yes vote, without any statutory limit, in possible breach of Irish company and tax law, and undoubtedly constituting a major democratic abuse.

 

6) Breaches by the Irish broadcast media of their obligation under the Broadcasting Acts to be fair to all interests concerned in their coverage of issues of public controversy and debate. Newstalk 106, owned by Mr Denis O'Brien, a committed supporter of the Yes side, was quite shameless in its partisanship on its current affairs programmes.

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No Geoff, I'm being anti-thick folk, who change their vote in an obviously EU contrived re-vote. :twisted:

 

It's not that the voters are "thick" as you so crudely put it, rather it's the corrupt system that ignores the wishes of the electorate when the vote doesn't suit the agenda. What will happen if the UK gets a referendum and votes against the Lisbon Treaty, do you think the EUSSR will let it rest there? Of course they won't, they will expect the "Thick Brits" to either keep voting until they come up with the correct result or, more likely, work around the problem with contrived concessions that aren't worth the paper they're printed on. The whole system stinks. :evil::evil:

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What will happen if the UK gets a referendum and votes against the Lisbon Treaty

 

Are you certain that the UK would vote against the Lisbon Treaty, I'm not. :?

 

No I'm not, which is why I said "IF" :wink::wink:

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Only hope we don't get a referendum- reading the reasoning for the Yes vote made my head hurt...

 

What sort of turnout did the Irish have- doesn't change the result- just curious to see how engaged in the democratic process our friends across the Irish Sea are.

 

Poles and Czechs next?? they seem to do quite well from EU don't they??

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I'm rather surprised that anyone is surprised by this ploy of an authority holding referendums until it gets the result it wants.

It happens here in Warrington - take, for instance, the repeated planning applications for a new Stockton Heath Primary School.

 

When I see an authority, be it local, national or European urging the electorate to vote a particular way, my natural instinct is to vote the other way because I don't trust any of 'em!

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Why are you all specualting about a referendum anyway?

 

Andrew Marr's interview with David today drew out confirmation that the Conservatives would only hold one [/b]only IF[/b] the Lisbon Treaty hadn't been ratified and only IF they were in power. Is this a double IF?

 

Now given that the two remaining countries have clearly stated that they will have ratified the Treaty in their respective countries within the next three to six months the double IF appears highly unlikely.

 

Mind you I could have got things wrong because Dave, who stated that he would be straight talking totally confused Andrew Marr and the viewers so much that nothing could be certain after 10 minutes on this question.

 

Is there anyone who saw the interview that can clarify Dave's position on the Treaty?

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When the Lisbon treaty has been ratified by all countries, and therefore in force, there will be no referendum allowed so it doesn't really matter what Call me Dave says now. :shock::shock:

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Ireland were bullied into voting yes by means of "look what you will lose if you vote no again" tactics.

 

Ireland are a net gainer from Europe and stand to lose a great deal of investment if they voted no. The UK however is a net contributer and it would only serve to be of benefit (in monetary terms) if we voted No. That is why we will not get the chance to do so. Brown will be ordered to hold out for his general election as long as he can (no doubt with a promise of a top Euro job some time in the future) and the others who are still to vote will be ordered to have their referendums long before the next UK election (regardless of wjhether Dave wants to call one or not - the Eussr will take no chances)

 

The idea of Europe as a trading block is a pretty good one. The idea of Europe dictating every aspect of our laws and lives is not

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