Burtonwood Service Area

[archieearl]

I always thought that the buildings at Burtonwood Services were listed buildings, I was surprised to see that the one on the Westbound had been demolished.

[McBain]

A sad farewell to the old tea-pot lids then

[the_nana_jackson]

I always thought that the buildings at Burtonwood Services were listed buildings, I was surprised to see that the one on the Westbound had been demolished.

 

If you wanted to keep them you should have done something about it .. we did, after all, leave the back-hoes and building equipment behind .. even though it would have been too expensive to transport them back home again, you could have used them .. others, in much smaller communities took the equipment left there .. with our blessing!

[Peter T]

[wolfie]

She's American

[asperity]

That would explain it

[vic]

I don't think any postwar building in Warrington is listed.

[Bazj]

I don't think any postwar building in Warrington is listed.

 

There aren't many listed buildings left anyway Vic... the bloddy Council has knocked them all down already!

[vic]

The council hasn't knocked any down. I think the last time listed building consent for a demolition was given was for the derelict old house next to Greenwoods on Winwick Street.

[Bazj]

Perhaps I should have said.... stood idly by and done nothing while they were knocked down by others!

[Peter T]

The age of being pedantic is still with us.

[vic]

Again, which listed buildings would these be? (where the Council "stood idly by")

[Bazj]

Well for a start there was the Bay Horse pub on Winwick street. "Accidentally" knocked down by contractors after the council had finished work for the week.

 

There was also the old Boteler School which was let to get in such a state by this council that it was knocked down for safety reasons. The fact that it was in the way of an access road to the new housing development...... make your own mind up.

 

There was the 17th Century traders villa which was also on Winwick Street.

 

The plague house on Manchester road was knocked down a good few years back and finally we have Bewsey Old Hall. A building which will be left to fall apart and then sold to the highest bidder when there will be no objections because anything will be better than another pile of rubble

 

Now not all of the above may have been listed, but the Council did bugger all to protect those shining examples of our towns heritage Vic....

 

so over to you

[Peter T]

And don't forget the Plague House on Wash Lane, Latchford.

[vic]

Well for a start there was the Bay Horse pub on Winwick street. "Accidentally" knocked down by contractors after the council had finished work for the week.

So you blame the Council for not mounting a 24/7 guard?

 

There was also the old Boteler School which was let to get in such a state by this council that it was knocked down for safety reasons. The fact that it was in the way of an access road to the new housing development...... make your own mind up.

Not listed (but I agree it might have been saved)

 

There was the 17th Century traders villa which was also on Winwick Street.

Falling to bits, dangerous, with a front door facing the side of another building; not much chance of restoration.

 

The plague house on Manchester road was knocked down a good few years back and finally we have Bewsey Old Hall. A building which will be left to fall apart and then sold to the highest bidder when there will be no objections because anything will be better than another pile of rubble

A very good few years back (was it listed?). And if Bewsey Old Hall is left to fall apart, blame those who opposed the Urban Splash proposal. It's not the Council's property.

 

Now not all of the above may have been listed, but the Council did bugger all to protect those shining examples of our towns heritage Vic..

Well, it seems a long way from a Council standing idly by while vast numbers of listed buildings disappear...

[byrdy]

The plague house on Manchester road was knocked down a good few years back

 

Where was the plague house on Manchester road?

[Evil Sid]

not found any reference to a plague house in manchester road.

 

there was one mentioned at 57 wash lane latchford that was demolished in 1957.

 

and there was a borough fever hospital in aikin street.

 

also came across this site for those that are interested.

 

http://www.mywarrington.me.uk/history.htm

[Dizzy]

Vic... It doesn't matter if a listed (or locally listed) building is NOT the council's property they have a DUTY to protect it. Not that it seems to matter

 

I agree with BazJ on this one and if I could find the list I had a a year or so ago which showed the many buildings that have now GONE due to lack of interest or turning a blind eye until it's too late then you might start to see a pattern. I have it somewhere... anyone got any ideas on I might have put it

 

Unfortunately sometimes due to intentional lack of maintenance, care but most of all lack of interest by the people who are supposed to protect and monitor them means that many more of the older buildings in Warrington are inevitably destined for a similar fate...... unless of course they accidentally burn down first

[vic]

So, from Baz's "council standing idly by" while listed buildings are demolished we've so far come up with two listed buildings in the town lost in the last 20 years (50 years?), and only one with the Council's consent.

[Peter T]

Some people are too busy to get the detail. Perhaps instead of snide comments, you could oblige.

[observer]

It might have helped if central Government provided the required funds to renovate such buildings, assuming they would list them in the first place.

[Bazj]

So, from Baz's "council standing idly" by while listed buildings are demolished we've so far come up with two listed buildings in the town lost in the last 20 years (50 years?), and only one with the Council's consent.

 

Vic,

 

you are obviously a council apologist and there is no reasoning with you. The council do things for their own ends, The Boteler School (whether it was a listed building or not) was a massively important building to this town and its heritage and the council let it fall into a massive state of disrepair over a period of years and then finally flattened it to provide access for a housing estate.

 

Bewsey Old Hall is also a massively important building to this town and should not be turned into another housing development to satisfy Urban Splash and their weird ideas; it should be turned into a heritage centre for the surrounding park, the former airbase and the town as a whole

 

In the case of the buildings such as the Bay Horse pub which have been knocked down, why didn't the council insist on it being rebuilt at the contractors cost? They would have been insured and it isn't impossible to rebuild a flattened building, just look at the Frauenkirsch in Dresden. That massive church was rebuilt after collapsing following Dresdens battering at the hands of 100's of Lancaster bombers; so anything is possible. The Bay Horse stood in the way of the councils dream for Winwick Street; that is why it was knocked down and no other reason!

[vic]

Some people are too busy to get the detail. Perhaps instead of snide comments, you could oblige.

Not sure if I'm supposed to be the snide one. If I am, how could I oblige with providing detail that doesn't exist?

So, from Baz's "council standing idly" by while listed buildings are demolished we've so far come up with two listed buildings in the town lost in the last 20 years (50 years?), and only one with the Council's consent.

Vic,

 

you are obviously a council apologist

No, just after accuracy

 

and there is no reasoning with you.

What, because I'm right?

 

The Boteler School (whether it was a listed building or not) was a massively important building to this town and its heritage and the council let it fall into a massive state of disrepair over a period of years and then finally flattened it to provide access for a housing estate.

That may be, but NB it was NOT a listed building, which does rather make a difference to any "reasoning", i.e. if the developer didn't want to retain the building (and English Heritage didn't think it important enough to list) there's not much the Council could do - though I did hear a suggestion that the developer might have been willing to convert it (but then that might have raised Bewsey Old Hall type complaints). Speaking of which...

Bewsey Old Hall is also a massively important building to this town and should not be turned into another housing development to satisfy Urban Splash and their weird ideas; it should be turned into a heritage centre

Show me the money! Urban Splash are not weird, they are arguably the most imaginative developers in the land, and adapt listed buildings that no-one else can see a future for.

In the case of the buildings such as the Bay Horse pub which have been knocked down, why didn't the council insist on it being rebuilt at the contractors cost? The Bay Horse stood in the way of the councils dream for Winwick Street; that is why it was knocked down and no other reason!

No powers to insist on that. And absolutely no evidence to support the accusation that anyone on the council wanted the Bay Horse (and the adjacent cottages) knocked down. If being a council apologist means not accepting opinion as fact, I'll oblige.

[Bazj]

Vic,

 

this is a forum mate not a public enquiry. I state on here about what I find to be wrong. True some of the buildings may not have been listed but the Boteler School had sod all to do with developers as it was wholly owned by the council and was used by them as a yard and storage facility for diect services. They let it fall into rack and ruin and they had it demolished because a developer with a bit of cash may have wanted access through where the building was.

 

I object to many things, but if it is accuracy you want may I suggest you contact the council and ask them to release the information you require rather than trying to come accross as mister high and mighty on here?

 

And there is no reasoning with someone who always thinks he may be right

 

As for Bewsey Old Hall, if Urban Splash had gotten their hands on the place it would have been turned into a very expensive development of flats to which no one in the communi8ty would have ever seen the insides of again.

 

I looked at a job in Levens Hall in Kendal a few years back and they were doing up a section close to the main hall which dated back to the 1500's. The chaps doing the work and responsible for the works were all excited showing me the walls and decor dating so far back but because they were turning the place into office units; they had to cover up the walls and the original features with false walls. They were not allowed to remove them but they couldn't leave them exposed so the encased them forever inside another wall where no one would ever see them again.... that is what would have happened to Bewsey Old Hall. The Councillors like Jo Grotty (Who supposedly represents Bewsey) should be banging on to get the place restored for the benefit of the community instead of furthering her political career moaning about big prisons..

 

No powers to insist on that. And absolutely no evidence to support the accusation that anyone on the council wanted the Bay Horse (and the adjacent cottages) knocked down. If being a council apologist means not accepting opinion as fact, I'll oblige.

 

Well it is hardly likey to have been documented in the councils minutes would it?

[vic]

Vic,

 

this is a forum mate not a public enquiry.

Well, yes, if this is a forum that doesn't enquire but is just a soapbox, then I'm sorry for trying to "reason". Hang on, didn't you say there was no reasoning with me?

 

It might have been a bit of knockabout, but do I take it your first intervention in this thread was not strictly true? "There aren't many listed buildings left anyway Vic... the bloddy Council has knocked them all down already!"