observer Posted March 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 .. which argues for our exiting of the EU and the re-creation of a manufacturing industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted March 30, 2009 Report Share Posted March 30, 2009 Roll on the revolution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevofaz25 Posted March 30, 2009 Report Share Posted March 30, 2009 I know this has been mentioned before but I have an issue with the protestors who turn up at these events and clearly have enjoyed all the trappings of the culture they are so opposed to. Â Same goes for the Plane Crazy mob- hand on heart, how many of them have never flown- even on their Gap year?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted March 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2009 You'd have to spot the one's with sun tans! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted April 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 Seems the G20 have agreed to throw in $1Trillion into the IMF pot, so that the big consuming Nations can start consuming again, thus allowing the Chinese and Co to get back to work. So, the Chinese (who seem to have all the cash), lend us the money in order to pay them for the goods that they can make with their cheap labour. We still owe them, they make even more money out of the trade, which allows them to lend us even more - errm, is this crazy economics of what?! Clever folk these Chinese! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Observer I never said I wanted a World government based on the EU haven't you said some where you have argued for a World government Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted April 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 I've advocated, on the basis of rational human evolution, that a global economy requires some form of global democratic institutions to exercise control and oversight over them - which is basically Brown's current quest. Also, the policing of global terrorism and control of missile,space and nuclear technology, all cry out for multi-national administration. Alas, the problem occurs, when you analyse the motivations of the various individual States in the world and their incapacity for altruistic endevour. You also only need to look at current super-State organisations like the EU, to witness how easily they become politically corrupted, arrogant and continually draw power from their constituents rather than devolving apopropriate power to them. Thus the conclusion: that mankind is not ready to adopt such a progressive move, and may require WW3 to focus their minds on such a solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I wonder.... if we did have WW3, who would bail out the French this time? because I am damned sure that no one in this country would even lift a finger to help them  A good war would put the namby pambys in their place I guess and bring some proper focus to the country again rather than worrying about Jade Goody and what expenses the Government Ministers are fiddling this time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Todays generation couldn't endure 6 years of war: fortunately they won't need to, as WW3 would last approxiamately 6 minutes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Don't we have to ask are American friends for permission to go to war these days,such is the state of our armed services Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Nope, they tell us when! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Don't we have to ask are American friends for permission to go to war these days,such is the state of our armed services  and just wait till we get the Euro Army..... that is when people will finally wake up to what Europe is all about, but by that time it will be too late; the blanket of Brussels secrecy will have fallen across all aspects of the parliament that they do not want us to know about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 that is when people will finally wake up to what Europe is all about  And what is it Baz you think Europe is all about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 And what is it Baz you think Europe is all about  Well I will answer your question Sgt, unlke yourself who stoops to making little jibes instead of a straight answer anytime anyone asks you to put your point across....  I think Europe is all about a dream of power for a small minority of elected politicians. It is about creating a super state to rival the USA and the former soviet block. The politicians in Europe think they know better than the people who elected them and regardless of what those people say, the politicians (once elected) will always follow their own mandate rather than listen to the people. When France, Denmark and Austria voted against the constitution there was a quick rethink and the constitution was suddenly reborn as the Treaty. When Ireland voted against that one, all the remaining countries in Europe pulled any plans for future referendums because they knew they would lose.  The British people were promised a referendum and were lied to by Labour and now we aint gonna get one because Brown is desperately trying to get it all passed before he loses the election as Cameron has pledged to hold one if it hasn't been ratified by then (whether he will or not is another matter!)  Survey after survey has put a massive 88% of the UK population wanting a refrendum but still Labour will not listen to the people because I personally think that most of our Labour ministers (Brown especially) are lining themselves up for top jobs in the future Euro Superstate. Look at Bliar and how he is lining his pockets as a UN ambassador visiting countries where 2 years ago, he was sending bommbers in to blow the crap out of.... nice little earner that one turned into (oh and don't forget his wife who is coining it in prosecuting mainly the British Government, for breaches of the Human Rites act that her husband brought in in the first place)..... they really have no shame!!  Politicians are all in it for themselves Sgt, can you not see that? It doesn't matter what is good for the country or the people, it is what is good for them that matters.  Europe is corrupt, sleazy and a totally bad idea for a country such as ours which is rich in the history of independance, democracy and inginuity..... Europe offers none of those things....  Now why do you think it is so good for Britain that it is worth piling billions of pounds more into it than what we get out of it? The scare stories about trade being cut if we leave are just that; scare stories and if they are true, that is pure blackmail and nothing else! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Heres what it actually does   http://europa.eu/index_en.htm  Have a good read take your time  No mention of a dream of power for a small minority of elected politicians any where, you deal in opinion I prefer fact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Please don't try the condescending approach with me Sgt, I am pretty sure you haven't read it all either.  The EU is a corrupt self serving club which can make millionaires out of its MEP's just by claiming expenses. That to me is morally and literally corrupt and how you can justify that is beyond me  I will have a read of your website but no doubt I could find a contradictory one which would show what the EU DOESN'T do for us.  Instead of just putting links to websites in front of us all, try the old fashioned debate angle and argue your own corner without having to resort to other more experienced pro-Euopean Mac users to help you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 No mention of a dream of power for a small minority of elected politicians any where, you deal in opinion I prefer fact  Oh and wake up and smell the coffee man.... do you really think they would start off the first page with "The European Union is a dream designed by a few politicians to make themselves rich"!?  Of course they bloody wouldn't so don't be so daft... even you might catch on to that one Sgt! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 You can only debate with facts you only have opinion, I dought what ever I say I will change it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Or even doubt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I can quote websites too... Â European Union European Union is destroying democracy and promoting corruption. Any opposition to the EU is suppressed by successfully manipulating conservative economic ideologies and the symbolism of Europe. Â EU glorifying propaganda does not correspond with reality. The European Union glorifies itself as the representative of Europe, which greatly consolidates the economic and political potential of the continent. The development of the EU is always praised as a doubtlessly progressive historical process increasing the welfare of the Europeans and ensuring human rights and democracy. Â However, broadly known economic data clearly shows that since the establishing of the European Union, the economy of its members has been weakening in relation to the rest of the world. The introduction of euro pushed the countries of Western Europe into a deep economic crisis; and, despite the fact that the European Economic Community has recently been the most efficient economic organization in the world, the European Union has already turned into a heavy burden for its citizens. Â The European Union spreads corruption Extensive experience of some countries in Eastern and Central Europe suggests that the European Union promotes corruption in its members not only by the means of enormously puffing up the number of bureaucrats and creating countless opportunities for bribery via various funds and programmes. Â For example, having just joined the European Union, Lithuania in 2004 became the most corrupt state in Europe. Â European Union destroys democracy The EU destroys all the democratic and legal institutions capable of limiting its powers and influence. By unscrupulously interfering into internal policy of its member states, the European Union undermines even the democratic responsibility of politicians, which always blame the EU in public for their own crimes and mistakes. Â By the way, the European Union undermines human rights too. The members of the European Union are free of critcs from most international organisations; therefore, the arbitrary powers of politicians and bureaucrats towards ordinary people there have become virtually uncontrolled. Â It can be seen clearly in Lithuania, where due legal process has become a privilege of the rich. According to public opinion polls conducted after joining the European Union, already about a half of the Lithuanians do not consider Lithuania to be a democratic state any more. Â The European Union evades any criticism by means of manipulating the symbolism of Europe ?Europe? is a positive and inspiring word not only for Europeans; therefore, although the EU represents only a part of the European continent, its bureaucracy is trying hard to monopolize the powerful symbol. EU bureaucrats exploit successfully the humble posture towards themselves of many non-EU states. Â For unknown reasons, even Russia accepts not being considered a part of Europe although it occupies a big part of the continent. Apparently Russians do not notice that in this way they indirectly recognise their cultural and moral inferiority in the eyes of the whole world. Â The propaganda of the European Union does not meet with any considerable resistance because the EU bureaucracy already controls not only Western, but also Central Europe, and a great part of Eastern Europe. By cynically manipulating economic ideologies, the symbolism of Europe, and the mythology of ?the historical mission of the European Union?, EU ideology makers and propagandists successfully neutralise any external and internal opposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Interesting site you choose to copy from  http://counter-propaganda.w3.lt/es_eu_/enes_eu_.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Unfortunate that I never even noticed the site it was hosted on, such is the feelings I have against the Eurpean Union. however it was the 5th one down on Google having typed in "european union corruption"; the first 4 were sites spouting about so called ANTI European corruption.... which as we all know is nonsense. But granted I did shoot myself in the foot! Â although equally interesting that you knew where I downloaded it from.... I could have equally have found it posted on another anti European forum or anywhere really.... but still no doubt you are gleefully drawing your own conclusions Sgt!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Why is it, that Kyje resorts to quotes of other peoples/organisational "opinions"; then tries to pass them off a facts? If you had a sufficiently strong belief and confidence in your own "opinions" Kyje; you would marshal the arguements and have them at your finger-tips. Baz is merely reflecting a view shared by the vast majority of European (never mind British) voters; who are now sick of this corrupt gravy train, seeking ever more pretension to being a Super-State, with a compulsion to micro-manage the everyday lives of it's citizens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Sgt,  have a look at this video. It is 42 minutes long and shows all that is wrong with Europe. It makes for interesting viewing (and I am only up to 12 minutes)  http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2699800300274168460&hl=en  I'll start on your pro european website tomorrow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Why is it, that Kyje resorts to quotes of other peoples/organisational "opinions"; then tries to pass them off a facts? Â Why indeed? But he is only doing what nearly everyone else does on this forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.