Paul Kennedy Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 If I'm listening to a crap piano player, I don't say "Right, let me play the piano parts as well as continuing to play my cello." I say "Get rid of this useless tosser and we'll get someone who can actually do what they're supposed to be doing," Ah but you can only do that if you have a supply of people to choose from.....and if the price is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissy Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Ordinary councillors receive allowances, they do not receive wages. Parish councillors receive nothing. This is one of the problems of course - to become a councillor to serve your community you need to be either retired with a decent pension or a person of 'independent means.' Sadly many people who would like to become a councillor are unable to do so because they need to earn a living wage. If you complain about 'all councillors being the same' implying they are all equally useless I think your problem is with the system of local politics rather than the way a councillor carries out their role. Some councillors are better than others and they are all individuals. You can't tar them all with the same brush. Perhaps if Carmina and Legion could elucidate on the specific issues we could have a more targetted discussion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kennedy Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Good post Chrissy. The term allowance is a misnomer, in so much it is a sum of money, currently about ?7,500 per annum which is subject to PAYE deductions. Executive Members, Leaders etc get more...and some are members of outside bodies for which they are also paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Hope your not advocating even more money for these so-called politicians Paul; the trough is being abused as it is; and more cash just feeds the greed. Whilst there will be a minority of folk who have sufficient of there own cash or who arn't obsessed with money; the majority are there because "it's a little earner"; not for any altruistic motives. Perhaps we need to look at a new system, of rotating "ordinary" folk as Councillors, similar to Jury Service? The problem with high payments is, that with those who couldn't possibly earn such levels of pay in the world of work, it's like winning the lottery - trouble is, put a beggar on a horse, and he'll ride to beggary! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kennedy Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Well yes and no actually Observer. I'd cut the number of Councillors, give them a maximum of 2 terms and pay them more on a sliding scale subject to meaningful qualifications/gaining qualifications....and base them on a NJC grade. Combine Mayor/CEO into an elected Mayor. Overall the costs would reduce. I don't have a problem with paying people well if they are fully accountable/hardworking/achievers. I think most people's concern is paying the existing crop more...and they do have a valid point. Personally I had, and could have a much much higher paid job back in business, but for the moment that's not what I'm about, so money is not my motivation for what I'm currently doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kennedy Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Anyway just over an hour to go. I'll get ready to go shortly. Maybe see a few of you at the count. Please come over and say hello. Good Night & Good luck to everybody, but more to some than others. PS You get next year off, as there are only Euro Elections and I doubt if there will be a General Elecion. PPS Whatever the outcome remember the following from Kipling's IF: "If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster And treat those two imposters just the same" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Still a nice little earner,(?144/wk gross) Perhaps the electorate should have a scrutiny panel to assess whether the cllrs have ticked the boxes and served the Community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Somewhat naive Paul, as well as an unfair approach. Any "job" has a rate for "the job" which should be paid to ALL who are elected. Avarice isn't restricted solely to the poor or thick; one just needs to look at the City to realise that. I think the principle to employ is "that it shouldn't cost any individual more to do the job, than s/he would had s/he not bothered." Agree with the time limit (say two terms of 4 years) for ALL politicians - might sort out the careerists! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kennedy Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 Fair comment Observer, guess I was a bit twitchy when I posted and not thinking as straight as I normally do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 Your mind was no doubt on other more important things - and now you can celebrate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissy Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 I would concur with Paul that becoming a councillor for many people involves a substantial drop in income. Many, many councillors, of all shades, and Paul included, are people who have qualifications, skills and experience that put them into a high earning bracket. There is simply no way that a councillor allowance could be their prime motivation for doing the job. And if they weren't there because of a desire to serve their community they certainly wouldn't put up with the flack. With regard to pensioners as councillors - two things come to mind. One, in this day and age many pensioners have seen their pensions reduce or disappear, so they need to carry on working, and two, being a councillor requires a lot of energy, commitment to numerous meetings, saturday morning surgeries, telephone calls from concerned constituants at all hours of the day and night and on occasions outright abuse from some people. Do older councillors not deserve some credit for doing all of this instead of sitting in their slippers by the fire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 I read somewhere that a ward in Runcorn ended in a dead heat, so they drew straws to pick a winner In Liverpool an Independant (I think) candidate won and then defected to the Lib Dems to keep them in overall control Why not just take turns in running the council, after all just like in National Politics nothing changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 In Liverpool an Independant (I think) candidate won and then defected to the Lib Dems to keep them in overall control ( Surley if that is the case they should rerun the ballot? certainly if it was just after the election, I for one would not want to vote independant and get a lycra clad toga wearing liberal for a councillor. Someone should go and give him a kicking and make him defect back again!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 The Labour "defector" wasn't standing for election this time, and had become an "independent" BEFORE the elections, giving the LibDem Leader the opportunity to save the day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 wonder how much cash changed hands there as an "incentive" then?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 Probably not "cash"; a position on the Executive or a trip to a twin Town maybe?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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