Boots on the ground ?

[observer]

Seems Mr Bliar isn't full of contrition for sacrificing our young men in Iraq, and is now suggesting "boots on the ground" in Syria; to erase the ISIL Caliphate; something his invasion of Iraq created. Now having got their fingers burned in half cocked military adventures, the Western public don't seem to have any appetite for further involvements.  Whilst that may be advisable in the case of a complex and multi-sided affair like Syria; there may be a sound argument for a military involvement in Libya. With Cameron and Hollande's air campaign to bring down Gadafi, without any stabilization plan for the Country, we now have a failed State with two militia backed Governments and the presence of ISIL; totally incapable of stable and effective administration of the Country. Through this chaos a stream of sub-Saharan Africans are now making their way to a better life in Europe, facilitated by EU Navies bringing rescued migrants to Italy. So is there a case for a full blown invasion (preferably UN backed), of Libya by the West, in order to eliminate ISIL and to restore political stability, so that the position of Libya as the southern gate keeper to Europe can be restored ?   

[Davy51]

Apparently,soon after referendum day there is likely to be an announcement re setting up a European Army....no doubt this idea of sorting out the mess in North Africa will be ideal for this super force to cut its teeth on.

 

I would not be surprised if any campaigns this force is engaged in will be led by Britain with support from our allies coming from hundreds of miles away in the safety of Brussels committee rooms.

[observer]

As warned against by a bevvy of ex-Generals, who are supporting Brexit !   

[Davy51]

I suppose in a way the EU has suddenly received a wake up call after over 50 years under different names where it hasn't even given a thought to protecting its borders as a complete entity. How times have changed.

[observer]

Well it did have an agreed policy at the beginning; and that was the Dublin Convention, whereby external border States like Greece and Spain, would require illegal entrants to be processed and either granted asylum or not.  The idea being that the inner Shengan zone wouldn't require border controls, as this would be done by the border States.  As we now know, this fell at the first hurdle, when Italy and Greece allowed illegal entrants to continue their journey into the EU; this was then compromised by Merkel unilaterally suspending the Dublin Convention, and inviting them all to Germany.  Then when the inner States realized the consequences, they began to unilaterally erect border fences; such is the level of unity in the EU !   When push comes to shove, everyone's looking after Jack, with the possible exception of the UK !  But the question with Libya, is whether we want to re-establish a gate keeper in Africa to prevent the flow of migrants to Europe in the first place.

[Davy51]

Our biggest downfall of recent years is getting rid of the tyrants who ruled these countries & our aim should be to stop migration from Africa through Libya & other north African countries but will our Euro partners have the commitment & where with all to do it. I think many of our Euro friends will stick with the easy option & cheerily wave through any migrants en route to the more prosperous & welfare providing countries of northern Europe.

[observer]

Not sure "waving them through" has worked particularly well Dave: whilst the bulk may be heading for Germany or Calais, a considerable residue is left along the route and now that many Countries have finally woke up and fenced them off, they each have to deal with this residue and it's political consequences.  What I'm waiting for the media to do, is not just report the "rescues", but to actually follow the process of these migrants once they arrive in the UK for example. Are they immediately repatriated? No !   So what happens to them, where do they go and how much is it costing the UK tax-payer ?  There seems to be a deliberate attempt by Gov and Media to hide this information from the UK public.  

[Bazj]

Not sure "waving them through" has worked particularly well Dave: whilst the bulk may be heading for Germany or Calais, a considerable residue is left along the route and now that many Countries have finally woke up and fenced them off, they each have to deal with this residue and it's political consequences.  What I'm waiting for the media to do, is not just report the "rescues", but to actually follow the process of these migrants once they arrive in the UK for example. Are they immediately repatriated? No !   So what happens to them, where do they go and how much is it costing the UK tax-payer ?  There seems to be a deliberate attempt by Gov and Media to hide this information from the UK public.  

 

They will hide it until after the referendum and then quietly let us know bit by bit that they have failed to repatriate any and the EUCHR will be lining up to back their corner

[Davy51]

They will probably get soaked up by the black economy as cheap labour to keep farming costs down.

[observer]

Well "call me Dave" seems to have worked it out - he's allegedly got the SAS into Syria and Libya.   

[observer]

.... who have now helped the Free Libyan forces to liberate Sirte from ISIL, thus providing the possibility of blocking migrant access to Italy.

[Davy51]

There seem to be some strange allegations doing the rounds regarding our's & America's security people returning an opponent of Ghadaffi to Libya for interrogation purposes. Extraordinary,when both western governments vilified the Colonel & his regime over the Lockerbie bombing. We do have some strange bedfellows ,especially when the same government was implicated in the IRA arms scandal.

[observer]

Don't you remember Bliar meeting Gadaffi in his tent?   Even then, Gadaffi was operating as gate-keeper to Europe, and we needed to get him on side, so he'd send us oil rather than migrants.   

[observer]

Quietly, it seems progress is being made against ISIL in Libya, which shows what can be done, even with a small number of Special Forces on the ground. Believe the SAS is now pursuing a policy of saving money, by shooting two of these nutters with one bullet !   

[Davy51]

More Government cuts.