Branded

[P J]

The figure is 22000 more than in 2013 but don't let that get in the way of the usual UKIP sensationalism, remember Farages claim that 29 million were coming?

[observer]

More than that, what he actually refered to was "entitlement to come", which includes any or all of the 300million or so EU population, so his figure was quite low in that regard !   The figure is around 137,000 for THIS year alone, 15% up on the previous year, and that's just Bulgaria and Rumania; seems Camoron's promise to cut net migration to below 100,000 pa was slightly optimistic !  He was right about the begging aspect, as shown on the CH5 prog, showed them actually doing the statues routine with the begging bowl at their feet. But let's not worry about it, if our schools and hospitals are getting overcrowded; just keep the door open and let more in and stoke up the tension - liberal myopia at it's best. btw this is just EU migration, the illegals are still landing in Sicily, Greece, Bulgaria and Spain; waiting in detention camps for the next stage of their journey to Calais, then the UK. Talk about fiddling while Rome burns. 

[Bazj]

or burning while the Roma fiddle!!

[P J]

Right so leave the EU to solve the illegal immigration issue.  Lets look at that logically.  Why should Greece,Italy and France give a toss if the refugees flood into Britain if not bound by the EU to do so.  The Gendarmes will be giving them a lift up onto the trucks instead of trying to stop them at Calais.  Unless the plan is that leaving the EU will devastate our trade so badly that there won't be any trucks.  Theres a plan for the kippers, make Britain such a poor and awful country that nobody wants to come here.

[Sha]

Do you two argue for the sake of it?

 

It seems pretty obvious that Farage wouldn't know the difference between a Roma or a Rumanian. As Obs has said Rumanians are Caucasian, Albeit a very mixed race, with origins including; Celts Romans, Goths, a large element of Hungarian and many mixed  Western European settlers over the centuries.

The Roma ( or Sinti ) are a roaming gypsy people (DNA of Indian origin), does the fact that some of them were roaming in Rumania before they came here make them Rumanian? If so, now they are here they must be British.

Prior to the revolution these people had it good in Rumania, often living outside the law and getting away with it......probably because of their usefulness to the regime as 'informers'. For this reason they were despised by the Romanian people who since the revolution have ensured that life is not so easy for them over there anymore, hence their relocating to Britain.

 

I have some sympathy for genuine asylum seekers, I also see the need and the usefulness of some European workers, but I also see that Ob's has got a point. Britain has reached saturation level, there is no more room on this small Island for any more people.

There isn't enough employment opportunities, The NHS is stretched well beyond it's limits, we've already got enough homeless and we shouldn't keep building more and more houses.

One thing that really concerns me is the continued development of agricultural land. If there were a war or any kind of emergency, such as a world fuel crisis and we couldn't import food, what a bl**dy mess we'd all be in.

For our own survival we need to be able to be completely self sufficient if the need should arise. America has plenty of space - the asylum seekers and immigrants could go there.    

[observer]

The inability of the EU and the affected national Governments to defend EU borders against illegal entry, is due to a lack of decisive political policy by bleeding heart politicians and compounded by the insane decision making of the ECHR.  Operation Mare Nostrum, conducted by the Italian Navy and Coast Guard, was actually a rescue operation, picking up drowning illegals from areas close to the African coast. But did they then take them back to Africa - NO.  They exacerbated the situation by bringing them into Lampadusa and housing and feeding them in detention camps - crazy.  The UK Gov went as far as it dared by withdrawing support for Mare Nostrum, and ceasing rescue operations; on the basis that the traffickers were relying on it to get the illegals to Europe; like the ship from Turkey that was left on auto-pilot, heading for Greece; the traffickers having abandoned it, knowing the soft Europeans would rescue them and complete their journey to the promised land. What should be happening is a simple turning around of these vessels, or recue and RETURN to their points of departure.  This then raises other issues about co-operation, or lack of it by N/African, M/Eastern states and Turkey; many which are failed States like Libya and Syria (arguably something we've contributed to); this requires international co-operation to restrict illegal movements; and funding support for those refugee camps in Jordan and Turkey, housing those displaced by war. But, a large proportion of illegal entrants to the EU, are simply economic migrants, seeking "a better life". In a world of mass communication and access to TV progs from the "better off" world, folk living in relative deprivation can't be blamed for taking a chance at a "better life"; believing that Europe is somekind of promised land with streets paved with gold. But at the end of the day, nation States have a sovereign duty to secure their own borders and protect their populations; and this requires control over who enters their country. The life boat analogy still holds true, with desperate folk swimming towards the boat, which is full; difficult decisions have to be made to refuse to take them onboard, otherwise the boat will capsize.  The capacity of the UK to take an ever increasing number of entrants (both legal and illegal); is of obvious concern to anyone who can see beyond next week; an unprecedented rise in population will inevitably impact on the nation's resources, it's social cohesion etc; at a time when cash strapped Councils are struggling to cope due to austerity cuts. So, there is a problem, and someone needs to get a grip.

[observer]

Sha, largely concure with your post, but would point out, that the Roma, largely settled in Rumania and Hungary; and are thus Rumanian or Hungarian nationals, just like our own Gypsies will be classed as British, or Irish tinkers as Irish. There's no built in right to roam for the Roma or anyone else. They tend to be the poorest amongst their own Nations and with developed life styles based on begging and scavenging; so are thus despised by their own countrymen; who no doubt will be happy to off load them onto us. Not sure of the actual wording of the EU Treaty on free movement; but if it's the free movement of "labour", rather than the free movement of "people"; this implies that movement should be conditional on having a secure job PRIOR to entry; this isn't happening. As for "self sufficiency"; I agree this should be a goal; but a difficult one to achieve; during WW2 we relied on the merchant navy to bring in food etc; losing ships and men to a German submarine blockade; this meant gardens and parks being used to produce vegetables and rationing, that's how bad it was. So yes, we should develop the capacity to be as self sufficient as possible.