Pole position -

[observer]

Seems the Polish Ambassador to the UK, has described a UK exit from the EU as a disaster for Poland -  wonder why?!  Meanwhile, record numbers of Poles are now applying for British citizenship, just in case we do exit, in case freedom of movement and access to benefits may dry up ! 

[asperity]

There are worse people than Poles, and that includes a lot of native born Brits.

[P J]

observer in anti immigrant rant shocker

[Dizzy]

There are worse people than Poles, and that includes a lot of native born Brits.

Very true but personally I don't think it's about how nice or even hardworking the people coming into the country are it's about how many are coming in or wanting too.  Theres just way to many doing it in my opinion.

[P J]

We need immigration as we have a hugely distorted population with not enough young workers to pay for the upkeep of the amount of pensioners we have, especially the former civil service high earning pensioners. Without them the country is stuffed

[Dizzy]

So the immigrants are needed to pay for our pensioners upkeep while a lot of our youngsters can't get jobs or if the do not decently paid ones.   So who pays for the youngsters as they get older then when they have to claim job seekers allowance or other benefits and can't afford anywhere to live ?  Will we need to let more immigrant workers in to fund them too?  Sounds bonkers reasoning to me.

[observer]

 Wearing a bit thin now, that one PJ.  It's not a case of "we need", which implies choice on the part of the indigenous population; but "we're getting" , whether we like it or not.  It's all about numbers, as Diz rightly points out.  As for the fiscal equation, perhaps someone can tell us how much we contribute to the EU compared to the majority of the Jonny come lately E/Europeans ?

[P J]

Perhaps you could provide a pro/con accurate set of figures showing all benefits and loss from being in the EU? Good luck

[observer]

No need; the majority of folk have already made their minds up ! 

[P J]

I rest my case

[P J]

Polls show a referendum would vote to stay in, is that the majority you mean or is it down to how loud a few individuals shout?

[Bazj]

http://survation.com/poll-for-sky-news-reveals-breadth-of-opinion-over-europe/

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/21/eu-referendum-majority-leave-opinium-observer-poll

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/548252/51-per-cent-vote-quit-EU-poll-result-sparks-new-demands-early-referendum

http://www.itv.com/news/2014-12-15/poll-more-britons-favour-leaving-eu/

 

https://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3463/Support-for-EU-membership-highest-for-23-years-even-as-UKIP-rises-in-the-polls.aspx

 

Polls show a referendum would vote to stay in, is that the majority you mean or is it down to how loud a few individuals shout?

 

Depends which survey you believe then I guess

[P J]

???????????? it certainly won't be the company that provide the monthly opinion polls for the Daily Heil

[observer]

He who pays the piper, calls the tune.

[P J]

Dizzy, immigrants don't set the wages, that's employers. Some of them are shysters

[observer]

"Some" ???????!

[algy]

I think the majority of Poles have gone back home as there has been a shortage of skilled tradesmen there.

[Davy51]

Easy solution....compulsory euthanasia at retirement ,get the sick,lame ,& lazy off benefits so they can do the jobs that we "need" immigrants do. Plough the money saved into the economy. 

[Dizzy]

Compulsory euthanasia at retirement age seems a bit harsh Davy but then again how old is Obs ?   

 

Just kidding Obs

[observer]

Many a true word spoken in jest;  the nation's bill for elderly care is a time bomb starting to explode.

[P J]

Perhaps All pensions should be shared equally then Observer?

[observer]

? !      Errm, think Social care is largely funded via the tax system; unless you have a house to sell or a big bank account. However it's funded, the costs will be increasing dramatically, due to an increasing elderly demographic, living longer, but not necessarily in good health.

[Davy51]

It is a bit of a puzzle really....we have medical research telling us about the giant strides being made in medicine & treatment for many terminal illnesses that would have been unthought of not so long ago, but on the other hand patients are being quizzed about resuscitation preferences while others are being placed on terminal pathways. Perhaps these great strides will be consumer led for the private health care sector.

[observer]

At the end of the day Dave, it will all come down to money:  either the money will be found to pay for rising demand, or the ethics will be re-adjusted.

[Sha]

How about the ethics being adjusted in that there is more fairness in the tax system? That those evading tax by registering as off shore businesses are brought to book? If they were paying their rightful dues there would be plenty of money to pay for the NHS and elderly care etc.

(For example, Peel holdings and all it's subsidiary companies which link back to it for tax purposes is actually based offshore).  

 

If all the companies that are over here but employing cheap labour in other countries (e.g. call centres in India)  were made to pay extra tax to the tune that their profits would be equal to that if they were employing workers in Britain they would probably recruit over here instead -then there would be enough employment for people actually living here.

 

Also, if companies selling cheap goods (with a short life span) from China were made to pay a land fill charge this would make it viable for British companies to make and sell better quality, longer lasting goods. Thus creating the employment over here.