P J Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 that's the sound of a myth exploding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boris1066 Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Eh ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29906592 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Wondered how long it would take for this straw to be grasped. This refers only to EU migration and was prepared by an EU funded organisation; so the opening salvo in a propaganda campaign, that will last until we ever get a referendum. Lies, damn lies and statistics; produced by office bound academics; not noted for researching the streets. The CH4 news (a noted luvvie broadcaster) did a piece on this; in which they visited a Roma family in Maidstone. A father, mother and one child; when asked; the father said he was "in education", then when pressed, he said "job seekers allowance"; either being a cost to the British taxpayer, presumably they will be entitled to child allowance and health services, again a cost to the taxpayer, so inadvertently, CH4 shot their own fox. For all those EU immigrants in low paid menial work, they won't even be paying any tax, being below the threshold, and will no doubt qualify for income support. Yes, they are younger, but they will have family dependents, all requiring State services. The presumption that they will all go home at some point and not become burdens in their old age, when their kids have grown up with English as their first language, is a presumption too far. The evidence from previous migrations and from those Poles I've spoken to, is that they will remain in the UK. So good for the pro-EU brigade, but will be taken with a pinch of salt by those who prefer the evidence of their own eyes. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 Of course this refers only to EU immigration, that's the only kind of immigration that an EU referendum affects. The other , non EU immigration can be and is controllable by laws we set and a different subject altogether. This documentary on CH4, I never saw it but I presume it wasn't a live broadcast and that anything that the luvvie company making it didn't like could be edited out? This Roma on benefits, he will be accounted for in the figures that show that immigration from the EU benefits our country to the tune of billions, not anecdotal tittle tattle from a proven agenda led poster but a proper assessment of the numbers. Your argument from a financial point of view has been blown out of the water by this evidence and all you have to counter it is what you reckon some Poles have told you about staying here after retirement. Laughable really. Oh yes, I almost forgot, non EU immigration has also been found to benefit the treasury by billions too but no doubt you know someone from the local Balti house who disproves this also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davy51 Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 It is only natural though that if a chance of big money is available & you are invited to have some of it you would grab it with both hands.We can't really blame these people for coming here looking for monetary opportunities ,whether earned or benefit based ,when the money on offer must be like a lottery win in their home countries. One of the anomalies that does need sorting out is in our own labour market where employers can make wholesale redundancies only to fill these no longer existent jobs with east European agency staff who have sometimes been sourced via east Euro targeted agency recruitment ,usually offering reduced rates of pay, while our own citizens are left to claim benefits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeborn John Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 Brought to you by the same people who informed us that immigration from Poland would only be 'a trickle'. They're either fools or rogues, who'd believe either? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 Apparently the report stated that - 'Between 1995 and 2011, immigrants from outside the EU made a negative contribution of £118 billion over 17 years, the report found, using more publicly-funded services, including the NHS, education and benefits, than they paid in tax' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 As I said; a straw to grasp; even our Government hasn't got the data required to form an accurate picture; using guestimates to assess earnings in the black economy, to show how well the UK is doing, then get slapped with an EU surcharge - a complete joke. The presumption in this EU funded propaganda is that every EU migrant is in highly skilled, highly paid employment and is young, fit and single. However, the majority will be bringing families, starting families, will be in low skilled, low paid employment (EG fruit picking etc); so won't be paying tax; but will require housing, school places, NHS services etc. Fortunately, the majority of people are now seeing through this kind of propaganda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 There is not a presumption but an analysis of immigrants who came here between the dates stated and an independent assessment of the financial impact of said immigrants on the countiries coffers.There is no presumption of any kind of worker , simply a mathematical calculation of data. You, however , seem to be rather desperate to dismiss this as EU propaganda as it flies in the face of your own false claims and scaremongering and narrow minded attitude. It is you who is making presumptions without facts to back up what you say such as which immigrants will be coming here in the future ( clairvoyance), If you want to read or discuss "EU funded propaganda" I will post UKIPs manifesto here for you as we all know how they are hypocritically claiming every penny possible of the taxpayers money from the EU to pay for their pints down the pub. I thought you said that 60% were in favour of the EU, so how does that form a majority of people seeing through the EU propaganda ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 Some academic tied to a PC console, will be relying on data supplied by various organisations, including HMG; as HMG doesn't even know the full extent of immigration, and by definition will be clueless about the extent of the black market; folk are left with the evidence of their own eyes - just visit your GPs surgery or a Primary school. No probs with UKIP gleaning every penny from the EU to fund their Party; other Parties have been using public money in one form or other, to fund their activities for years. I quoted a YouGov poll, that alleges majority support for the EU; and you'd not be surprised that I don't believe that either ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 Ah I see they should have asked you as you are far more qualified to know the truth of everything and anything that doesn't fall in with your personal beliefs is either wrong, I'll informed, propaganda or flawed. Have you ever considered psychiatric assessment Napoleon? Ps. " tied to a pc console" Pmsl oh the irony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 No need to be "qualified"; merely observant - difficult for those with heads in the sand alas ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Right, so being observant involves ignoring anything that goes counter to ones argument and dismissing any findings or evidence that do the same as propaganda or simply refusing to believe it. Throw in a few "luvvies" and its ok. I suppose having ones head in the sand must mean reading the evidence collated and presented and having an open mind to things. Blaming immigration for all this countries woes is not only short sighted, it is stupid and it papers over the cracks as to why we are in a mess. Not many immigrants came here and crashed the banking sector. According to you they were all raspberry picking. You can't base the whole question of whether EU immigration is financially beneficial on the couple of Poles you know, that's stupid and ignorant. I was going to say that you couldn't make it up but you clearly can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Well there's plenty of folk sharing the same observations these days, hence the LibLabCon implosion - perhaps that's the "boom" you heard ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 "...plenty of folk..." = Daily Mail readers. http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/09/why-rightwing-press-cant-tell-truth-about-migration Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 The Daily Mail has left me slightly confused.Do millions of immigrants come to Britain to steal our jobs or to claim our benefits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fugtifino Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 And...to make our sandwiches: http://www.theguardian.com/media/mediamonkeyblog/2014/nov/10/sandwich-makers-of-britain-concede-daily-mail-front-page-is-right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 To be fair, the Mail has had to wait a long time for another National Socialist party to support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 So sandwich making will be one of the highly paid, highly skilled, highly taxed jobs, that the EU propaganda is talking about then ?! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 It will be one of the many jobs that the report is using to show the benefit to the exchequer that the whole of the EU immigration is providing. Your attempts at using individual little anecdotal irrelevances are lame to be honest. If I were to say that there are EU immigrants paying more tax per week than you earned in a year, when you did work, it would be true but also irrelevant. On this you are wrong and you don't like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Tis you who are deluding yourself; the demographic within any work environment will provide for more low end jobs than high end ones. Low paid menial work may not attract the local labour force, but it is certainly attractive to S/E Europeans; especially when they discover they can claim tax credits, child allowance etc. The amount of tax paid, is clearly relevant, (which is the point of this piece of EU propaganda); as each addition to the UK population places an added burden on State services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 You haven't read it have you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted November 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 You haven't read it have you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Yes - and it's claiming a net contribution from immigrants, which imo isn't true. So you can continue to support the liberal ideology that's led us into this mess if you wish, but the simple fact is, that a net population increase of 250,000 per annum, in the most densely populated country in Europe, is unsustainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.