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I see the admin running the facebook page for Warrington photos is trying to force posters to put the photos onto their own new website....  selling advertising space and trying to make a profit from other peoples scanning and posting is a bit naughty imho. They are trying to justify it by stating they are doing it for Warrington>.....

 

Bit of a cash grab if you ask me. Their defence about Facebook taking all the advertising etc. is a bit weak seeing as there are a lot of other benefits associated with having the images on a facebook page such as notifications when new pictures are posted, ease of use on a mobile device etc. etc.

 

Seems like someone is out to destroy the facebook page for their own ends

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Baz, your assesment in my opinion is absolutely correct as the guy that is running the site has stated openly that money is one reason that he started the new site venture, plus he is the owner of a photographic business and trawling all these photos on to the site gives him an unlimited choice of free material.

 

I initially posted 1,073 photos of Old Warrington (most that I had posted on WW some time back) to the original FB 'Warrington Photos Warrington Born' site, my intention was to allow as many people with Warrington connections to see what the town was like many decades ago and also to download the photos if they so wished, the response was amazing with many positive comments from people all over the world and I really felt that I had provided a useful and enjoyable service to the community, however this was to end very quickly as within a few days a new site had been created and access to the photos on the original site was completely removed with all the photos that I had uploaded being transfered to the new site, I could instantly see that there was the possibibility of an intention for the creator of this new site to use the photos for financial gain, I requested that all my photos be removed from the site immediately, a few emails were exchanged resulting in all the batches of photos being removed, I then terminated my Facebook account. I am very disappointed that the photos are no longer available for the public to see as I spent many hours uploading and adding detailed descriptions to these photos, however I'm glad to be out of the melee that appears to be going on out there.

I would like to say a big thank you to the WW member who helped and advised me in the process of removing the photos.

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I'm glad to see this thread. I'm quite sad with how the facebook page has gone. For my own selfish ends I'd like the new site to succeed because it's nice to have a busy, vibrant site with lots of people sharing the same interest. I do think they're going about it all the wrong way though. There will be a few people who object strongly and make a big fuss and an equally small number of people who will try and support it and make it work however the vast majority (who make the site what it is) will simply shrug and walk away and the community that had built up will simply dissipate. 

 

I did see mention that someone has set up a rival fb page, has anyone seen it?

 

I'm so sorry all your hard work has gone to waste Algy, such a shame, not only for you personally but also a loss that the collection isn't online and available to everyone anymore. 

 

EDIT - Just re-read your message Algy and have only just grasped the implication that they removed your original photos from the fb page - I'm shocked! I've been on that page for ages, it originally had a flurry of interest when it started a few years ago which died down when the fb format changed (made it hard for anyone other than admins to post pictures). Then they either changed it back or someone resurrected the old format page and the interest built up again. It only reached a manic level when you posted your collection, you were key in making it a roaring success. So it looks like they took took the interest/audience/activity you built up with your hard work and have tried to use it for their own ends. Before you stepped in the page was nothing like as successful.

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Alan, I think your comments are completely confused and false.

 

You uploaded around 1000 images to the WPWB Facebook page and then shortly after you deleted your account making all of the photographs disappear.

You then reinstated your Facebook account and apologised for your lack of understanding on how Facebook works. I believe you blamed it on your age which I believe is 74 next birthday.

 

None, I repeat NONE of the photographs were transferred to the new Warrington Photomag page by anybody.

In fact you personally joined the website yourself and uploaded around 1000 photographs. Your statement above this post is a total fabrication and I feel you should set the record straight immediately.

 

After around 24 hours, you decided to delete all your posts from the Warrington Photomag website, something that you seem to be in the habit of doing. I am led to believe that you uploaded photos to this site and them deleted them causing dead links on various pages?

 

When you deleted some of your posts (not all) on the Warrington Photomag page, you wrote to me asking me to remove the rest which I did for you and which you commended me for my cooperation in doing.

 

QUOTE "I can only commend you for your total cooperation on this matter"

 

Alan removed his own photographs from the Facebook page. No administrator of the group page removed any of Alan's photographs.

Alan is thinking about starting his own website with his own photographs. He wants more control on how they are to appear across the Internet.

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I believe it also needs clarifying as to why the new website has come into existence.

 

The Facebook group page was started 4 years ago and has enjoyed huge success with over 5500 members joining the group.

The administrators of the group have spent countless hours without help, looking after the page, monitoring posts, deleting spam among many other things.

Members come and go and delete photographs that people enjoy on a regular basis. The 1st image ever posted has probably not been looked at in over 3 years, it's lost in the depths of Facebook.

 

It was decided by the admins of the group to open a purpose built website and encourage people to join it and post their photos/comments.

Many have already done this and are enjoying the Warrington based site, made by Warrington people, advertising Warrington businesses.

Advertising will be the only source of revenue for the site owners and will enable them to better serve the contributions made by Warrington people.

There is and never will be any charges to use the new website.

 

Now, about financial gain.

 

The website was NOT set up for financial gain.

Oculus Studios advertises on the site and is the author of the site.

 

Why not leave it as it is and leave the Facebook page alone?

Because the admins want things to be better for people to enjoy a better experience and they don't believe Facebook offers this.

 

But you'll be making money out of advertising?

Yes, to pay for web space, software plugins, etc. We feel that should be paid for out of advertising revenue, don't you?

Currently Facebook advertise and receive revenue from the group page for the admins efforts.

 

But you have a photography business and you stand to benefit from all the photographs.

 

Rubbish!

 

I have a photography business, I will advertise it on the site as will other businesses.

My photography business is TOTALLY independent of Warrington Photomag.

 

I hope this clarifies all of the negative comments so far, we would like you to join Warrington Photomag but if you don't, that's your choice.

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To answer your comments culedude, who I presume is Tony from Warrington Photomag.

 

You uploaded around 1000 images to the WPWB Facebook page and then shortly after you deleted your account making all of the photographs disappear.

You then reinstated your Facebook account and apologised for your lack of understanding on how Facebook works. I believe you blamed it on your age which I believe is 74 next birthday.

 

I did upload and add descriptions to 1073 photos to WPWB FB page, thinking that the photos would remain there for all to see I then terminated my FB account as personally I don't care for FB, the following day someone on here then contacted me to inform me that all the photos had disappeared, I then reinstated my account etc. I did say it was probably down to my age and hopefully Tony you do reach my age then you may understand what I'm talking about!.

 

None, I repeat NONE of the photographs were transferred to the new Warrington Photomag page by anybody.

In fact you personally joined the website yourself and uploaded around 1000 photographs. Your statement above this post is a total fabrication and I feel you should set the record straight immediately.

 

After returning to the photo section of WPWB we were denied access to all photos for whatever reason? and were directed to your new site, then foolishly I joined WP and uploaded all the photos again, to your Warrington Photomag site.

 

After around 24 hours, you decided to delete all your posts from the Warrington Photomag website, something that you seem to be in the habit of doing. I am led to believe that you uploaded photos to this site and them deleted them causing dead links on various pages?

 

I was unhappy about the new site and felt that I had lost control regarding compiling and adding descriptions also I felt there was a conflict of interests regarding the site, the fact that it is owned by a professional photographer that would have total control over everyones photos made me uneasy (my opinion only). Regarding what I have done on WW it has nothing whatsoever to do with you!, however I shall explain, I have always let the photos remain on WW for long periods to allow everyone access and to download what they required, plus I have never watermarked or defaced the photos in a way that would detract from viewing enjoyment. The reason I eventually remove the photos from WW is that I periodically clean out the photos from my Photobucket account, many of them having nothing to do with Old Warrington as we tend to use many photos on here to illustrate points of history and to aid general discussion on the forum plus photos that I take generally.

 

When you deleted some of your posts (not all) on the Warrington Photomag page, you wrote to me asking me to remove the rest which I did for you and which you commended me for my cooperation in doing.

QUOTE "I can only commend you for your total cooperation on this matter"

Alan removed his own photographs from the Facebook page. No administrator of the group page removed any of Alan's photographs.

Alan is thinking about starting his own website with his own photographs. He wants more control on how they are to appear across the Internet.

 

Yes! Tony, I did thank you for your cooperation in removing the photographs from your site, I'm certainly not ashamed of doing that, surely that is what any person with a descent standard of manners would do under those circumstances.

 

Alan was thinking of starting his own website, however Alan has decided that will not happen, there may be other ways of making them accessible to the public domain?.

 

Correct me if I have misunderstood what I have read on FB, Tony, you did state that money was one of the reasons for making the Warrington Photomag site, nothing wrong with that I hasten to add as long as everyone is aware of that fact when joining the site. I was not informed of that fact when I joined!.

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Oh Tracy is that what you see? The "age comment" as you call it is actually a quote from Alan.

 

Alan, this FINAL email to me from your good self doesn't sound like a man who is being bullied:

 

"Tony, thank you for your cooperation on this matter, I assure you there is no animosity intended on my behalf and I can only commend you for your total cooperation on this matter, I am also so pleased that you have allowed me to continue as a member, that means a great deal to me. I'm 74 next birthday and the thought of creating my own website  really excites me and believe me excitement does not come easy at my age. I shall keep you posted when everything is up and running. I wish you all the success with Warrington Photomag for the future.

Regards,

Alan."

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I read this thread before I went to sleep last night.  When I woke up, I remembered that I had put some pics back onto the sister site in response to people who had shown an interest in them.

 

Today, I decided to remove the pics but can't find an option to delete them.

 

Could you advise me how to do that please, culedude?

 

Thank you in anticipation.

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Alan, this FINAL email to me from your good self doesn't sound like a man who is being bullied:

 

"Tony, thank you for your cooperation on this matter, I assure you there is no animosity intended on my behalf and I can only commend you for your total cooperation on this matter, I am also so pleased that you have allowed me to continue as a member, that means a great deal to me. I'm 74 next birthday and the thought of creating my own website  really excites me and believe me excitement does not come easy at my age. I shall keep you posted when everything is up and running. I wish you all the success with Warrington Photomag for the future.

Regards,

Alan."

 

Tony just when did I accuse you of trying to bully me?.

 

As I intimated previously good manners cost nothing and I still do thank you for your cooperation in removing my photos, I was expecting much harder resistance than I met, which was actually no resistance at all!. At that moment in time there was no animosity from me and still isn't, I was pleased to remain a member although as you stated at the time with reduced privileges, at that time I had considered creating a website (no longer applicable), I would have happily informed you and offered you membership (with reduced privileges of course), and why should I not wish you well with your website, as they say "no skin off my nose", so all in all what is your gripe with me?.

 

I still do think you have an ulterior motive in running Warrington Photomag and shall not easily change my mind on that point, however that is just my opinion, it is up to others to decide for themselves what they think or whatever they wish to do.

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Crikey, I haven't got the foggiest what this is about as I don't do facebook.

 

What I do know though, is that it's bad form to post the contents of a private email on a public talkboard (this may not bother algy, but that's not the point), so I think I'd be reluctant to trust anyone who did that as well.

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I completely agree with your comment about the contents of a private email being posted on here by the recipient as being out of order Fugtifino.

 

Under normal circumstances I would have deleted that however as Algy has already replied I wont. 

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I completely agree with your comment about the contents of a private email being posted on here by the recipient as being out of order Fugtifino.

 

Under normal circumstances I would have deleted that however as Algy has already replied I wont. 

Not a problem Dizz, I'm still a bit miffed why I received reduced privileges on WPhotomag though, it looks as if I have been demoted cos' I tuck me' photos off, so be warned you WPhotomaggots if you delete your photos you may lose your privileges, I'll let you into a secret though, it doesn't hurt honestly. :D :D :wink:

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For what it's worth, I feel the best custodian for all our Warrington images would be a not for profit organisation such as Culture Warrington.  They would have the relevant expertise, revenue streams  and infrastructure to make it work and are always looking for ways to get local people included in their activities.  I will ask the relevant people what they think and report back.

 

I also agree that it is very bad form to use a private email in such a way.

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I get confused who is who and what is what these days PJ (nowt new there then I hear you say ha ha). 

 

Is Culture Warrington the global umbrella type name for the museum and library etc or a completely separate entity?  

 

Sounds like a good idea though and hopefully that could result in all the other images that the museum and library have stored away in their possession being more freely available to view too even at low resolution so not suitable for printing to safeguard them all from piracy... ooh arrrr (that's my pirates voice by the way, scarey eh? although it does sound exactly the same as my famer voice, and my Cornish accent, and my....)  :lol: 

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Dizzy (such a perfect nom de plume  x)  it is the newly created charitable trust which is indeed the "umbrella" for arts etc.  If I get chance I will nip in for a chat tomorrow or failing that early next week.  I believe that our heritage photographs are an extremely valuable record of the towns history and also that the images we are all taking now are forming part of our next stage of history so are also valuable for future generations. 

 

P.S.  having recently worked in Bristol I was shocked by how many of the locals do pirate impressions all the time :D

 

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Well PJ you should know me by now and if I don't know I ask but at least I got the umbrella bit correct.    As for my perfect non de plume ha ha that made me giggle but then again maybe it is just a disguise to hide my superior knowledge of everything :lol:

 

At least mine is not out of date though as everyone knows PJ's have been replaced by Onesies these days... you are so out of touch and behind the times ha ha  :P  

 

OMG I was so very tempted to change your screen name to that for a joke  :lol:

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Agree with PJ, this whole episode shows that our heritage photos need to be in the hands of a public body who will preserve them and make them available for future generations to view. It's almost like a Museum is needed or something .....

 

imho it's also bad form to follow people from one board to another and try and shut down discussion if it's not what you want to see. I did initially try to support the new website but the tone of recent comments has put me right off.

 

Oh, and the age comment, makes no difference whether it was a quote or not, we all know what was (rudely) being inferred.

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An online Civic Archive or Treasury which the public can use as a viewing gallery, a discussion area and a resource for researching the various questions arising from old and not so old photographs.  Add to this the expertise already in place amongst the Trust staff and I think it would be a superb idea for the town its people and also for the Trust.  It is something I would like to contribute my images to.  I will go in today and pitch the idea.

 

I would also like to forward Algy and Dizzy as guest curators, I could think of none better.

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Thankfully, I haven't posted photographs on the site in question.  If I had, I would feel really betrayed.

 

On Facebook people have posted their photographs because they felt a 'Warrington' connection. However, people seem to be upset that the spirit of the group has disappeared and I have to agree with them.

 

Last night I posted a plea to culedood, asking him to advise me how to remove pictures from the sister site.  I know that he was viewing the site earlier today, as was I.  Maybe he has been busy today and unable to help me, I don't know.

 

In the absence of that help, could you advise me please, Algy?  I no longer want my pics on that site but I can't work out how to delete them.

 

As far as the site is concerned and the responses on here from culedood, he can't seem to see that he has made a massive PR faux pas.  Such aggressive responses, coupled with the fact that he revealed a private conversation, off the top of his head, is abhorrent to me.

 

I can only speak for myself but I wouldn't be tempted to use his photographic company for the fear that my private business would be revealed.  

 

Of course, I will have to tell this to my family and friends, too  :cry: It's only fair.

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Sheila. I have been on the FB WPWBorn site and can't see any sign of your photo content or postings under the name you are using on here, so unless you post on there under a different name and avatar it looks as if they have disappeared, if not go back a on this topic and post him a PM on here I'm sure culedude is reading the posts on this topic.

Tracey had posted while I replied  and has given you good advice.

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