boris1066 Posted February 11, 2013 Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 Boris, the reason the government isn't able to stop the import of this meat is because they have to prove it is harmful to health. Distasteful as we might find the thought of eating horsemeat in this country, it is a fact that it is part of the menu in a lot of our neighbouring countries and hasn't been shown to be harmful. British beef was blacklisted because of BSE. Okay there is an element of fraud in this, as the products are advertised as being beef not horse, but apart from that what is the government supposed to do? Under EU regulations our FSA isn't allowed to subject imports to tests more stringent to those imposed on domestic produce. Fact. As I recall BSE was around for a long time (since 1984) in Britain and less so in France. In France it was known as JCB, as whenever an animal developed the symptoms they buried it with the aid of a JCB ! It was the association (wrongly as it now seems) of JCD/BSE that caused the panic. The European Agricultural Comission banned World wide export of British beef and other products, not because he thought there was a problem with British beef, but to protect the beef market in the remainder of the European area. At that time various euro partners had already banned it. The government went unsuccessfully to the Euro court to over turn the ban. Unfortunately our Govt seems to try to play by the rules. Sometimes I would prefer it if they took a more robust approach and banned these imports untill such time as the extent of this contamination/ corruption is established. So in this situation, Stuff EU regulations ! Stop talking like a victim ! Morrisons/M&S source their meat in the UK which is controlled and traceable. Support British Farmers !! Footnote During the crisis the Govt could track a single cow born in Appleby almost three years ago right to the stall where she slept in the County of Cumbria. And they even tracked her calves to their stalls. But they were unable to locate 125,000 illegal immigrants wandering around our country side. Maybe we should give them all a cow ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted February 11, 2013 Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 all the times in the past that I have said "I'm so hungry I could eat a horse".... I never thought I would actually end up doing it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 Lt Kije, yet again I find I'm having to repeat myself. The EU has taken on the role of food safety for the whole of the EU. Why would we spend more money duplicating what the EU is supposed to be doing? Well the obvious answer to that is because the EU is incapable of doing the job, so perhaps our FSA should start testing imported meat to ensure that it's what it's supposed to be. And while we're at it, and as the EU isn't doing what we pay them so much to do, we may as well invoke article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty and get out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted February 11, 2013 Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 Well the supply trail for these products appears to snake all round Europe - sold in UK, processed in Luxembourg, supplied from France, which were supplied from Romania. Seems with all this travelling, we should start to be concerned about worse things than horse meat. I'll be buying only from the Butcher's shop now, and be asking what actually goes into his burgers or sausage first. I'll also be reading the labels carefully in things like fish fusions, to establish what they are and where they're sourced. IF, and it's a big "if"; everybody does this, maybe the s/markets would get the message and start procuring their products from local produce IE Britain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 And in addition, the Food Standards Agency (set up by Liebour) is independent of government anyway. See this snippet taken from their website: "Although the FSA is a government department, it works at 'arm's length' from government because it doesn't report to a specific minister and is free to publish any advice it issues." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 After all your anti-supermarket rhetoric Obs, I'm surprised that only now you've decided to only buy your meat from the butcher. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Sid Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Ever wondered how they used to make Jelly years ago. Remember listening to one of Blaster Bates recordings, bit of a eye opener that was when they told him that all the things that had just "slithered" of the back of the truck went to make jelly, You know "horses doubries and donkeys queer things" was the exclamation "what those wibbly wobbly jellies" Any way is it any worse than raw fish or sushi as it is better known( I know sushi is not raw it is "cooked" using the acidic content of whatever they cover it with). And they do say that Britain is a nation of horse lovers, maybe they just got the wrong idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 The FSA was set up to be independent from government intervention Asp, not quite sure what you are trying to get at, at least you have now read the link. And your mud throwing at the EU seems to have stopped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 After all your anti-supermarket rhetoric Obs, I'm surprised that only now you've decided to only buy your meat from the butcher. Do as I say, not as I do????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 I've been using a butcher's shop for years for the majority of my meat shopping thankyou. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Sid Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Well spoke to my doctor today as part of a general check up and he told me to watch what I eat. Off to haydock racecourse in the morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 The FSA was set up to be independent from government intervention Asp, not quite sure what you are trying to get at, at least you have now read the link. And your mud throwing at the EU seems to have stopped. What I'm "getting at" is that with the FSA being set up to be independent of government intervention, you cannot turn round and blame the government for failure in the system that in any case is run by the EU. I don't sling mud at the EU, they are quite capable of giving themselves a bad reputation without any help from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 All you is sling mud at the EU, in the vain hope that some will stick, the government tell the FSA, what to look for, it is independent in the same sense as the Office of National statics is. So you are still trying to blame the EU? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Oh I see!!! So the ONS produces the figures (GDP, inflation, employment/unemployment etc) that the government wants them to, nothing embarrasing then. Actually I think that the whole system is the fault of the EU primarily with our government culpable for allowing the EU such free rein with what should be their own responsibility for the safety of their own citizens. However I believe what is now going to emerge (and is in fact already starting to happen) is that the supermarkets are going to take a lot more interest in the sourcing and testing of their products. I believe Tesco have dumped the French company responsible for production of some of their "contaminated" products like a hot brick, and are testing all such products themselves. So eventually market forces will do what government regulation has failed (as usual) to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 A deregulated free market? Was it not people taking advantage of a weak deregulated free market system that started all this. Tesco have no choice as a loss of faith in their brand would lead to a loss of profits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Did I suggest a deregulated market? All I said was that the supermarkets will have to take a closer interest in the products they are selling to the extent of doing the job that government should be doing, even if this means duplication, if they are to regain credibility with their customers. As it is the EU, by its lack of proper regulation, has lost any credibility it ever had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 2 sites in the UK raided for selling horse meat!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Is it illegal to sell horsemeat in this country? Or just passing off horsemeat as beef? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 I get regular emails from the FSA regarding latest 'food' withdrawals and other things (I must have once subscribed with them for something or other and have received them ever since. Mostly I just read the title which says enough so I rarely open and read them. Anyway .... I just got another one and it seems the FSA and police have raided two licenced slaighterhouses in the UK today (Yorkshire and Wales) with regards to the horse meat issue. http://www.food.gov.uk/news-updates/news/2013/feb/fsa-raid-horsemeat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Kije Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 So it was the FSA and the Police, not the EU and the Police? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Is it illegal to sell horsemeat in this country? Or just passing off horsemeat as beef? No idea but the UK does have 5 abattoirs in the UK which are licensed to slaughter horses. Not sure if it ALL get's exported though. Seems daft if we can kill and export the horses for human consumption but can't actually eat it ourselves. Saying that apparently some UK horse carcases have tested possitive to containing bute... although the meat was shipped off before the results came back in come cases 'allegidely' and according to the press/news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 So it was the FSA and the Police, not the EU and the Police? In today's raids here ... Yes it was the FSA and Police Lt (like the link says). If you look at the FSA website and recent articles/advice over horse meat etc it does tend to say that it is the suppliers responsibility to check for the authenticity and provenance of their product they use/sell and I think the same applies in a way to all imports and exports. Obviously the FSA do get involved but I guess they have now become fully involved in more rigorous and wider testing as the whole system of export/import/labelling etc is under suspicion across many countries now. Can't say I've read everything though as to be honest, although it's 'bad', up until now I've not really been that bothered that I have probably eaten horse ..... or was it a donkey Apparently they are going to check chicken and other meats too now..... doubt chicken would be horse meat as I'd guess it's too light in colour. I wonder what other 'meat' could be passed off as chicken. I know when my brother badly sliced his hand open on the fleshy part below his thumb it did remind me of a chicken drumstick at the time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Hey!!!! Did you hear that stable door slamming after the horse(meat) had bolted? :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted February 12, 2013 Report Share Posted February 12, 2013 Hey!!!! Did you hear that stable door slamming after the horse(meat) had bolted? :lol: One thing about eating horse meat (providing it doesn't have any nasties in it of course) is that it will taste and look a whole lot better than the awful pankakes I just made. They wouldn't cook properly and no way could we flip them (or even turn them with 2 spatulas) so most finished up resembling a broken and mushed up BRAIN. I should have taken a photo really Last time I buy one of those easy shake up mixes.... hey maybe there was a brain in it after all and that is where mine will eventually finish up Be warned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleopatra Posted February 13, 2013 Report Share Posted February 13, 2013 It was Shrove Tuesday already....? I had forgotten about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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