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Tax on phone lines?

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Everyone happy to subsidise the private sector provision of faster broad-band ; and have your TV licence fee top sliced to help local TV? :?

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Living in Westbrook, I would happily fund faster broadband!! speeds here are crap but BT and the likes get round such things by saying "up to 8MB broadband" or "up to 24Mb Broadband"....We are lucky to get 1MB so yes, put new cables in and do what is necessary!! :lol:

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I?ve just had a quote from BT to upgrade the broadband at my office.

?7,100 to install the line and then ?537 per month :shock: and all this because the Padgate exchange is well behind the times in terms of broadband technology.

 

I can?t see that the proposed charges are going to do much, (if anything) to address the major shortcomings of our system. To me this just looks like a tax for the sake of it.

 

Bill :)

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If mobile broadband gets just a bit quicker - say 4Mb - I'll just get rid of the landline altogether.

 

Surely the cheapest way of meeting the governments 2Mb minimum promise to all households is via the mobile networks anyway.

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if they got all the money back that the mp,s have fiddled, sorry mistakenly claimed :wink: then it be able to pay for at least half the prospective cost.

 

thing is will i be paying for it as i do not have a bt line just virgin media. another question is will my mother be paying towards it. she has a bt line but has no pc and would never have one as she has no interest in anything like that.

 

perhaps we could get some our footballers to stump up a few bob towards it. :twisted:

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thing is will i be paying for it as i do not have a bt line just virgin media. another question is will my mother be paying towards it. she has a bt line but has no pc and would never have one as she has no interest in anything like that.

 

I was just about to post exactly the same questions :wink:

 

I've got Virgin fibre optic cable already too.... had it for about 10 years now (Cable & Wireless/Ntl/Virgin) so why should I pay an extra ?6 for something that I already have and have paid for. Recon they've had well over ?6k out of me over the years already.

 

And as you say a lot of people don't want or need internet acccess so WHY should they pay... and others may be happy with the service they already have so why should they be forced to change or pay either.

 

Is Gordon the Dreamer going to start to tax people for NOT using computers and the internet next or worse still for being too slow on them :roll:

 

He's a baffoon and no doubt it will all backfire and cost ?billions more than anticipated and no-one will be any better off :roll:

 

Seems they are also planning on getting rid of AM and FM radio waves/channels too in the big digital plan :roll:WHY ??????????? What is wrong with them :roll:

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I've got Virgin fibre optic cable already too....

 

 

How come St Heath have the posh stuff, whilst we in Latchford just have cable? :oops:

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Perhaps I've not got it after all then :shock: I always thought that 'cable' meant 'fiber optic' :oops: I'm sure that's what they have always said it was :shock:

 

Apparently Virgin has drawn up "secret plans to open its cable network to rival telephone and broadband companies as part of an audacious bid to boost revenue and head off possible regulatory intervention" :wink:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/may/04/virgin-media-cable-network-internet

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Didn't NTL(?) dig up our roads and pavements years ago to install fibre optic cable? :?

 

Not in Westbrook they didn't!! :lol:

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Perhaps I've not got it after all then :shock: I always thought that 'cable' meant 'fiber optic' :oops: I'm sure that's what they have always said it was :shock:

 

 

I need to go and lie down in a quiet room. :oops:

I am on about the wording. YES it is FIBRE OPTIC, but us peasants just call it cable. :roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

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Observer?s suggestion that a tax to improve the Internet is subsidising the private sector seems a bit wide of the mark because it?s like saying that building a new motorway only benefits business users when clearly it benefits everyone.

 

The analogy with the road network is pretty good. The Internet is effectively a motorway network, with is a super fast set of cables linking key points in the country. These then feed out from exchanges that use normal telephone wires to connect to our homes and businesses rather like normal roads and it?s on these old wires where the speed starts to drop off. The longer the wire the less speed you end up with so if your near to an exchange you may well get your 8 meg BT speed but if your miles away it can end up being as slow as a dial up connection.

 

What?s needed is to replace the old wires from the exchange with fibre but that?s going to cost a fortune and who?s going to pay for it now that BT doesn?t have a monopoly? The obvious way would be for BT to share the local cable network but the two are rival competitors both chasing the same market and in any case, there are many rural areas not served by the cable network.

 

The only way I can see this changing is for BT to extend the optical system out of the exchanges to smaller nodes that then could use the existing wires over a shorter final leg of the journey. Either that or cut down all the telephone poles and put everyone on cable.

 

The current system for business applications like mine does nothing to help anyone else. For me to get a reliable 2 meg connection it would cost me ?30,000 over three years and that?s just not viable whereas if the network was extended beyond the exchange everyone would benefit.

 

Food for thought?

 

Bill :)

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Bill, I've no probs with tax-payers investing in the "private" sector: PROVIDING they get a return on such investment. :shock: It needs to be remembered, that not everyone can have or wants to surf the net, and the better analogy would be like taxing non-drivers to subsidise car tax. :?

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Ah! I see what your saying now, your talking the likes of BT rather than the end business user, so yes it doesn?t make sense to tax phone users when if anything, it should be the Internet users who should be paying.

 

How you get a return on such an investment would probably be impossible to gauge but if the idea is to make broadband available to everyone, then the bulk of the investment would go to serving the needs of the minority and as such, we would see little benefit.

 

Bill :)

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Bill, I've no probs with tax-payers investing in the "private" sector: PROVIDING they get a return on such investment. :shock: It needs to be remembered, that not everyone can have or wants to surf the net, and the better analogy would be like taxing non-drivers to subsidise car tax. :?

 

Obs... the problem is that you are looking at todays internet usage and looking at it in a way that the likes of my mum, your mum; people born of another age who have no interest in computers, will somehow be forced to pay for others who will use it. To go back to Bills analogy, imagine 40 years ago when the planners were contemplating the M1 and M6; hardly anyone had cars and it was a big gamble to provide such a wonderously wide section of tarmac for what would have been a few cars to use. (watch Steptoe & Son ride again and the bit where Harold ends up coming back down the M1 on the horse and cart.... hardly any cars on there!!) Imagine how it would be if those motorways hadn't been built; what would the countrys roads be like now?

 

It is an investment in the future because the internet is the future in a more massive scale than it is today and if the infrastructure is not in place, heaven knows what will happen!

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Bill, I've no probs with tax-payers investing in the "private" sector: PROVIDING they get a return on such investment. :shock: It needs to be remembered, that not everyone can have or wants to surf the net, and the better analogy would be like taxing non-drivers to subsidise car tax. :?

 

Obs... the problem is that you are looking at todays internet usage and looking at it in a way that the likes of my mum, your mum; people born of another age who have no interest in computers, will somehow be forced to pay for others who will use it. To go back to Bills analogy, imagine 40 years ago when the planners were contemplating the M1 and M6; hardly anyone had cars and it was a big gamble to provide such a wonderously wide section of tarmac for what would have been a few cars to use. (watch Steptoe & Son ride again and the bit where Harold ends up coming back down the M1 on the horse and cart.... hardly any cars on there!!) Imagine how it would be if those motorways hadn't been built; what would the countrys roads be like now?

 

It is an investment in the future because the internet is the future in a more massive scale than it is today and if the infrastructure is not in place, heaven knows what will happen!

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That?s all very true Baz but just to put some perspective on this, my business simply couldn?t operate these days without the Internet such has been the change in recent years. My operating costs have been drastically reduced as I no longer have to drive out to work on site and I have two members of staff who do the majority of their work from home via the net. The savings I?ve made allow me to keep my prices competitive, which in turn filters down to the public.

 

I?m currently trying to improve one aspect of my business but my Internet connection just isn?t up to it. I?m struggling trying to maintain just a basic service over rusty telephone lines that Mr Bell put up a million years ago. My only options are to move office or pay BT a bloody fortune, which is really annoying, when you consider our European neighbours enjoy speeds and reliability that we can only dream of.

 

Bill :)

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well in these days of cheap mobiles i would suggest to my mother to buy one and then get rid of her bt phone and line. would serve them right. the way things are going i may be tempted top get rid of my home phone and just use the mobiles. i am on pay as you go and use it very little, it is on twenty four hours a day so that any of my family can get in touch if they need to. :?

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Perhaps I've not got it after all then :shock: I always thought that 'cable' meant 'fiber optic' :oops: I'm sure that's what they have always said it was :shock:

 

 

I need to go and lie down in a quiet room. :oops:

I am on about the wording. YES it is FIBRE OPTIC, but us peasants just call it cable. :roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

 

You are just picking on me now Peter :P I usually just call it cable too but I was just being a little more precise to avoid confusion. :lol:

 

Do you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder becasue you are on that side of the canal :lol: None of my friends over that way seem to have a problem with it or think they are peasants :P

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well in these days of cheap mobiles i would suggest to my mother to buy one and then get rid of her bt phone and line. would serve them right. the way things are going i may be tempted top get rid of my home phone and just use the mobiles. i am on pay as you go and use it very little, it is on twenty four hours a day so that any of my family can get in touch if they need to. :?

 

I will do similar if I am forced to pay the extra ?6 :lol:

 

There are three of us in the house all with mobile phones and I've just checked our monthly tariffs and in total we can all phone each other for 900 minutes a month as we are on the same network :wink: and we can make and additional 1000 minutes of calls to ANY other landline or mobile numbers for free too..... :wink:

 

... So WHY have we got a landline number in the first place I ask myself. I guess it's just so other people can call us cheaper than phoning our mobiles :shock:

 

So when push comes to shove I will just ask Virgin to either reduce my monthly package by the new ?6 charge or I will cancel my landline and possibly my TV/braodband package too .....which of course they will do as they wont want to lose my ?50 a month :lol:

 

No doubt other suppliers will either offer a similar reduction or offer a reduced rate to entice new customers to change over to them... sort of defeats the Governments objective really :roll::lol::lol:

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You are just picking on me now Peter :P I usually just call it cable too but I was just being a little more precise to avoid confusion. :lol:

:P

 

Nah, just teasing. And no to the second bit. Totally chilled and what you see is what you get. :wink::D:P

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It does seem a bit of overkill complaining about a charge of less than 2p/day. If it speeds up my connection it is well worth the expense. I shall save up so that I have the six quid ready.

 

The Motorway analogy is excellent and deflates the " won't affect me so I won't pay" attitude.

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Bill and Baz; I'm not going to miss ?6 per year; the point I'm making is: that we had years of brainwashing about how more efficient "the private sector" is at doing things; now, since bailing out and all but nationalising the banking system, it now seems that "public" investment is no longer a dirty word - so, providing it is treated as an investment (that will eventually make a return) I've no probs with the general tax-payer investing in the future of our telecommunications - after all, isn't that how it was done once - GPO then BT? :?:wink:

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Will it be ringfenced, or just go in to the general pot.

 

Not a problem with paying a bit extra if we end up with Japanese / Korean ( south not north that is :wink: ) broadband speeds and reliability.

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