Unbelievable -

[Davy51]

So ,in that case,how can HMG stipulate quarantine for UK citizens returning from EU holidays & 14 day quarantine when arriving in holiday destinations  being imposed by destination EU countries?

[Confused52]

1 hour ago, Davy51 said:

So ,in that case,how can HMG stipulate quarantine for UK citizens returning from EU holidays & 14 day quarantine when arriving in holiday destinations  being imposed by destination EU countries?

In the first case using the Corona Virus Act 2020 and in the second case using their equivalent Public Health laws. Freedom of movement does not overrule Public Health law the Commission are just causing Brexit trouble.

[Observer II]

My guess is it's going to be quite a while before we see tourist flights Dave, even if Ryanair think differently.  We've got the comical situation of 2m markers being painted on the Airport lounge floors, so folk can social distance prior to boarding a packed aircraft - go figure.        😷

[Latchford Locks]

Sod that for a game of monkeys

It will be a good while before you get me sitting in an aicraft for a few hours sat with total strangers

Who in their right mind would take a chance for a few days in the sun?

 

[Latchford Locks]

The lake district has never seemed so appealing 

 

[Observer II]

I agree with you Latch,  but you can see the pressures developing from interest groups. Ryanair was the guy who proposed the idea of having folk standing up on flights, so he could really get his money, and money is what they're all about.  😷

[Davy51]

Unfortunately, our European neighbours have economies based on sun  soaked holidays  attracting mass tourism & are desperate to get us back in numbers. Some of them will promise the earth in terms of health standards & precautions concerning  covid19 just to get their visitors back. Belief is in the mind of the beholder,

[Observer II]

Ironically, Greece did best in the lock down stakes, but  less spread = less immunity for the Greeks;  at least some of the tourists will be taking the virus with them,  so it'll kick off again.  😷

[asperity]

4 hours ago, Observer II said:

I agree with you Latch,  but you can see the pressures developing from interest groups. Ryanair was the guy who proposed the idea of having folk standing up on flights, so he could really get his money, and money is what they're all about.  😷

Ryanair isn't some "guy". The "guy" you're thinking of is Michael O'Leary who has come up with ideas for maximising the income of his company (which is, after all, his job) such as passengers standing and the removal of toilets so as to increase space for more passengers (who goes to the toilet on a plane? Gross). More passengers per flight/more revenue from passengers/cheaper tickets for same passengers. Higher charges for baggage, less passenger baggage more freight possible etc, etc. The point being if you don't like the terms of the contract then don't fly Ryanair. If you ever watch "Airline", which is about Easyjet, you will see how some air passengers are still under the impression that the airline is there to give them the cheapest way of getting from A to B while still catering to their every whim and treating them like royalty. The reality is that they are there to provide a service at a reasonable cost to the passenger and profit for themselves. Money is what they are all about Obs, you are right about that, but do you want them to run at a loss? Boeing 737 aircraft aren't cheap you know, and even Polish pilots demand a good salary.

[Observer II]

Suppose at the end of the day, you get what you pay for; and cheap gets cheap.   😉

[Davy51]

We do cost effective flights & cost effective self catering apartments & manage to squeeze in about 3 x 10 day jaunts/year.

You're a long time pushing up the daisies & having fun while you still can is important. Tried a 3 day taster cruise once & 3 days was enough.

[Observer II]

Think by "cost effective" you mean cheap Davy ?     I used to go Cruising,  the price  has now rocketed,  but will no doubt come down as demand plummets. Can't see anyone with any sense going on a Cruise or a crowded plane in the near future.   Mind you, I suppose they could contribute to herd immunity !     😉  😷   And right on cue,  we've got claims that a second wave of the virus is due next Winter, so back to square one.   💀

[Latchford Locks]

I'm just grateful for all the wonderful memories of past family trips to Spain in the days it was still regarded as a status symbol.

All a long time ago now but hey; memories last a lifetime.

I just hope the upcoming generation get the same chance some way one day soon.

Kid and families grow up so quickly and then the chance has gone.

[Davy51]

Right on there ,Obs ,just getting with the modern parlance ,but as you rightly say ,i mean cheap. 😀

[Observer II]

Well, the Greek beaches are open to the locals, just needs all those tourists in packed aircraft to bring in the virus now.   Meanwhile,  our own beauty spots are bracing to receive the lemmings,  even though there's nothing open yet, so a long journey to sit in the car and admire the view.   Looking like a slow motion car crash by the day,  so for the oldies with underlying conditions, who still want to stay on this mortal coil;   stay home - stay safe.   😷

[Davy51]

I was talking to a relative in Cornwall earlier today & he said they were having trouble with second home owners wanting to invade their lockdown. The local outbreaks have been kept very low down there.

 

[Observer II]

What's been a revelation in this health crisis, has been the apparent ability of society to adapt to new ways of living and working; which back in "normal" times would have been criticised as unworkable, utopian or marxist.  EG: Working from home and avoiding the commute.  Suddenly taking rough sleepers off the streets, although this will soon end if and when the Hotels start to expect guests once again; perhaps "second homes" could be used ? !    A marked reduction in traffic congestion and air pollution,  and a return to the simple joys of riding bikes or even walking.  A reduction in City gang culture and activities.    As the Arch Bishop of Canterbury suggests, is this an opportunity to learn lessons of how we conduct ourselves as a society,  what are the really important aspects of living as communities.   The big test, will come when the fear subsides and the virus becomes an unpleasant nightmare.   How will the financial costs be met ?  Will we return to the years of austerity, that largely fall on the poorest with cuts in services, that largely undermined the ability to face the pandemic ?    Or will we, like after the huge costs of two world wars, just accept the cost as a long term debt to repay over decades ?   Will those we have clapped at eight o'clock every Thursday,   be cherished as our most valued workers and not subjected to pay freezes and will our commitment to the provision of safe and affordable elderly care be taken on by the politicians.?   Will our reliance on international trade and supply chains be challenged by a new era of National self sufficiency ?    Will we treat every occupation as essential to our overall wellbeing and not looked upon as menial and unworthy of indigenous labour, and paid accordingly ?    Will global travel be seen as the polluter it is, and a destroyer of natural habitats, and will youngsters accept that they can travel the globe by virtual means from their TV or PC ?   So, lots of issues for our future politicians to grapple with, assuming they can for once take the long view, past the next election.    😷

[Confused52]

19 minutes ago, Observer II said:

What's been a revelation in this health crisis, has been the apparent ability of society to adapt to new ways of living and working; which back in "normal" times would have been criticised as unworkable, utopian or marxist.  EG: Working from home and avoiding the commute.  Suddenly taking rough sleepers off the streets, although this will soon end if and when the Hotels start to expect guests once again; perhaps "second homes" could be used ? !    A marked reduction in traffic congestion and air pollution,  and a return to the simple joys of riding bikes or even walking.  A reduction in City gang culture and activities.    As the Arch Bishop of Canterbury suggests, is this an opportunity to learn lessons of how we conduct ourselves as a society,  what are the really important aspects of living as communities.   The big test, will come when the fear subsides and the virus becomes an unpleasant nightmare.   How will the financial costs be met ?  Will we return to the years of austerity, that largely fall on the poorest with cuts in services, that largely undermined the ability to face the pandemic ?    Or will we, like after the huge costs of two world wars, just accept the cost as a long term debt to repay over decades ?   Will those we have clapped at eight o'clock every Thursday,   be cherished as our most valued workers and not subjected to pay freezes and will our commitment to the provision of safe and affordable elderly care be taken on by the politicians.?   Will our reliance on international trade and supply chains be challenged by a new era of National self sufficiency ?    Will we treat every occupation as essential to our overall wellbeing and not looked upon as menial and unworthy of indigenous labour, and paid accordingly ?    Will global travel be seen as the polluter it is, and a destroyer of natural habitats, and will youngsters accept that they can travel the globe by virtual means from their TV or PC ?   So, lots of issues for our future politicians to grapple with, assuming they can for once take the long view, past the next election.    😷

Rather a lot of what you wrote is the same old lefty tripe. Just because when faced with a level of death that would cause a spiral of death the government decided to take action from which the side effect is to close down the economy does not mean that it is a sustainable course of action. It isn't and the government have made it clear that the hope is to get the economy moving again. How the debt will be paid is a mystery and until we find out how much it is going to be and how other countries in the G7 intend to act together it is just political troublemaking to suggest how the UK should act.

[Observer II]

None so blind as those who will not see  !          😷

[Confused52]

18 minutes ago, Observer II said:

None so blind as those who will not see  !          😷

Maybe you will become more realistic in later years!

[Evil Sid]

Does make you wonder if we need to have mp's in the houses of parliament. if they can all work from home then think of the savings in travel exes etc....🤔

 

[Davy51]

Scrapping HS2 should free up a good chunk of cash to put to shut down costs. The new & enlightened approach to internet business & politics has pulled the rug from under HS2.

[Observer II]

Good example Sid, of seeing is believing -  these things are being done, not socialist theory anymore, fact.    Wouldn't expect dyed in the wool Tories to accept it, as it upsets their Universe;  and it's the supreme irony that this big Government agenda has been carried out by a Tory Gov.  What they may come to regret is that once you give things to the peasants, it becomes difficult to take them back !     😀