Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Sha

St Thomas's Bell

Recommended Posts

Diz, I've already said I will donate if the money I give goes to Walton Lea if not used for the bell.

If it was going 50/50 to Walton Lea and St Thomas's Church or any other worthwhile charity that would be OK too.

 

I do not want to give to this newly formed Civic Society. Does anyone know what their aims are? From their website it appears they are in consultation with the Council re the proposed demolition of the Cabinet works - yet what stance they are taking remains to be seen. The old School bit is said to be going to be demolished as well for access to the site, this little building is very well loved by Warrington people and a lot more important than the Bell. For all we know the Civic Society may not be protesting but merely rubber stamping the demolition. To think I'd even unwittingly given a donation to an organisation that is aiding destruction would turn my stomach.

 

They have set this appeal up very badly, I suggest they change it quickly.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you contacted the Civic society to ask the question if your donation could go directly to Walton Lea rather than being split if enough isn't raised Sha?  Maybe you should.

I do see where you are coming from in a way though but it seems to me that the Civic Society are working very hard to save the bell from the melting pot and also working hard to make sure the Garnets Tower and the Old Industrial School etc are kept safe from the bulldozers too.  They are certainly not working along side the council to 'rubber stamp' any demolition.

Anyway all that aside...

Re the Crosfields Bell...

Update today is that the online giving page which has only been running for a day is now up to £170
Separate cash & cheque donations received from members of the public in the last day or so are £161
and of course the 2 very generous donations of £1000 each (amounting to £2000)

WHICH BRINGS THE TOTAL SO FAR IN ONLY A MATTER OF DAYS to £2331....... which is almost HALF of the money required for the deposit to secure it and stop it going into the melting pot.

Pretty good that :D :D :D

Also after being asked by the Civic Society chairman the  new M&S in Stockton Heath have kindly agreed to allow fundraising in their store this Saturday for the saving of the bell. 
So if you are in there and spot the people collecting please throw your loose change (or wads of notes) in the tubs and give whatever you can  :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok so it seems I'm the only person interested in saving the old bell on here......

So purely for my own benefit and interest I thought I'd just post myself an update on how the funding to raise the deposit by Friday 12th to stop the bell from being melted down is going.

Online donations seems to be a bit slow for some reason but not others by cash & cheque.

HALF WAY THERE NOW..... and more fundraising tomorrow should boost it even further.

From the 'Warringyon Civic Society' facebook page https://www.facebook.com/warringtoncivicsociety/?fref=ts
and the 'Save The Crosfield Bell' facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Save-the-Crosfield-Bell-228260800841619/?fref=nf


draft%20fundraiaing%20target%20chart%20t

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Aww and the young kiddies from the Ferry Link Club at Thelwall have been making and selling bell biscuits and have so far raised £50.

How lovely is that and nice to see youngsters getting involved and being taught the value of our heritage assets:D

 

Ferry%20Link%20Club%20biscuits_zpsih0pqi

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe Warrington borough Council could show some interest and support too !!

I'm sure they must have seen all the press coverage about it and all the comments on all the local facebook groups including the two groups I posted above..... not to mention this topic as I know a lot of them read this forum !!!

So come on WBC are you going to help save this piece of local heritage from the melting pot then or what?

John Crosfield and his family were one of the main benefactors to Warrington back in their day and the council probably wouldn't even have Bank Park and the Town Hall if it wasn't for them.
I fact there's a heck of a lot Warrington wouldn't have had if it wasn't for them.

Have a read here....... https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=TsG8AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA4&lpg=PA4&dq=crosfields+quakers&source=bl&ots=sHGID2VaL8&sig=MNmWzopgZoZoCICHO2fvJ_VlyA8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwie2sKSgt7KAhXLvBQKHSDnDxQQ6AEIPzAF#v=onepage&q=john%20crosfield&f=false


 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe our councillors can donate a small percentage of their wage rise towards it. (1% and we could get two bells probably) :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

as an afterthought perhaps they could squeeze some of these house builder to donate a few bob as part of the planning permission sweetener. (might mean slightly smaller brown envelope though) :ph34r: :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe Warrington borough Council could show some interest and support too !!

 

I'm sure they must have seen all the press coverage about it and all the comments on all the local facebook groups including the two groups I posted above..... not to mention this topic as I know a lot of them read this forum !!!

 

So come on WBC are you going to help save this piece of local heritage from the melting pot then or what?

 

John Crosfield and his family were one of the main benefactors to Warrington back in their day and the council probably wouldn't even have Bank Park and the Town Hall if it wasn't for them.

I fact there's a heck of a lot Warrington wouldn't have had if it wasn't for them.

 

Have a read here....... https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=TsG8AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA4&lpg=PA4&dq=crosfields+quakers&source=bl&ots=sHGID2VaL8&sig=MNmWzopgZoZoCICHO2fvJ_VlyA8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwie2sKSgt7KAhXLvBQKHSDnDxQQ6AEIPzAF#v=onepage&q=john%20crosfield&f=false

 

 

 

John Crosfield was an industrialist, an employer, a capitalist.... you are hardly likely to get that lefty lot in the Town Hall coughing anything up.... anyway, they have far more important things to pay for like the new furniture for their smart new taxpayer funded palace on Bridge Street

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To those of you refusing to donate due to the Civic Society saying they will retain 50 per cent of the proceeds should they fail in reaching their target - how on earth do you expect a Civic Society to perform any useful function for our town if it has no funds?

I am a member of the Civic Society and know others who give up their time freely to run the organisation and try and protect what is left of our town.

I am heading off to Stockton heath now to help raise funds to save this unique piece of history.

Hope to see some of you there.

If you want a Civic Society with teeth we will need deep pockets to hire the best lawyers further down the road.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I said I was happy to give to the Church bell fund - and I intend to.

 

It's still my opinion though that a 50/50 split between The Walton Lea Project and St Thomas's Church building fund would have been a better option and more attractive to potential donors.

 

 

The present Civic Society is only newly formed and though I know you Gary do your bit for heritage it remains to be seen if the Civic Society as a group will show any 'teeth'.

If it ever does, I will be more than happy to support them in any way I can!

 

Saving the Crosfield's Bell is a worthwhile project and will give the Civic Society some good publicity and promote the public's interest in 'heritage protection'.

But at the moment there are some very serious concerns re the loss of heritage buildings in the town - notably the Cabinet Works, Garnets Tower and the little infant school (sometimes called the Industrial School' on the same site.

WBC seem intent on allowing the owners to demolish. How strong a protest are the Civic Society putting up? WBC say they need to knock the infant school down for access - this is just a ploy to justify them giving permission because that building is certainly not beyond repair! (this school was also paid for from donations from John and George Crosfield)

Are the Civic society going to accept such sad excuses? I think how they tackle the heritage threat of these buildings will be a true mark of who and what they stand for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whatever, this thread is about saving the bell!

There has already been substantial donations from local organisations and the public - what seems ridiculous to me is that WBC and the local Parish council's haven't contributed. I think a good 'show of teeth' in their direction should have been appropriate!

Also Golden Gates Housing - whose 'flagship Offices' sit on the grounds of the Town Hall having robbed the public of open recreation space donated by (George brother of John) Crosfield - should be expected to give.

Another expected donor, perhaps the primary one, should be Peel Holdings. The forge machinery having been saved from the scrap yard by local residents was taken by Peel for safekeeping then 'disappeared' from their property. The money needed to buy the Forge machinery back from the scrap yard was paid 50/50 buy the retired Mr Cauldwell and Stockton Heath Parish Council. Did Peel ever refund this? They would have had insurance money if the machinery was stolen, did St/Heath receive any of it?

All of these need a good show of teeth!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

John Crosfield was an industrialist, an employer, a capitalist.... you are hardly likely to get that lefty lot in the Town Hall coughing anything up.... anyway, they have far more important things to pay for like the new furniture for their smart new taxpayer funded palace on Bridge Street

 

Baz, John Crosfield may have been 'an industrialist, an employer, a capitalist....' but unlike many, he and his family for some generations were extremely generous benefactors to the people of Warrington. It is for this fact that as a mark of respect the people of this town should show him some regard.

 

I think the importance of him as a 'benefactor of the town' rather than a 'noted industrialist' should be the focus of this campaign.

 

If he was just a grabbing industrialist I wouldn't be a supporter, it's because he was such a genuine, kind and caring man that I am happy to donate.

The Crosfields were not the usual type of industrialists of their day they treated their workers well and provided donations specifically to help the poor and not just to fan their own egos. In supporting the anti corn law league they would have been at loggerheads with their wealthy contemporaries.

 

As for your remarks about 'those in the Town Hall' their ideology is about as far removed from the Crosfields as you could get! But does whoever is in power change anything?

 

I'm not sure what you mean by 'lefty' is this a term that really has any meaning anymore? as far as I can see there are no real socialst/humanist influences to be found in politics these days it's just 'grabbers' 'grabbers' and 'grabbers'.

 

Perhaps that's why remembering the Crosfields is so important - as an example of men who didn't have to be self-centred to be successful!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://www.wirefm.com/news/local/two-weeks-to-save-historic-stockton-heath-church-bell/

 

We are told that St Thomas's parish were unable to find anyone to take the bell, so they offered it as part exchange for the new set being installed once the church is renovated.

 

This fund-raising would not have been neccessary, if St Thomas's Church had allowed those interested in acquiring the bell

to be given a chance to do that, instead of letting it go to the foundry in part payment for the new bells.

 

I am sure that any monies being raised under those circumstances, would have gone directly to the Church, and not the foundry.

All of this desperation to raise money by a deadline could have been avoided, and there would have been no need for the Civic Society to try to raise enough, as they are doing now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whatever, this thread is about saving the bell!

There has already been substantial donations from local organisations and the public - what seems ridiculous to me is that WBC and the local Parish council's haven't contributed. I think a good 'show of teeth' in their direction should have been appropriate!

 

SHA just as a mention Walton Parish Council HAVE donated to the fund pot. 

They agreed it at their meeting on Thursday night and handed over their cheque for £100 today :D  Thanks Walton Parish Council :D :D  

 

So far none of the other Parish Councils have though....but maybe they will if pressed more but I wont hold my breath.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://www.wirefm.com/news/local/two-weeks-to-save-historic-stockton-heath-church-bell/

 

We are told that St Thomas's parish were unable to find anyone to take the bell, so they offered it as part exchange for the new set being installed once the church is renovated.

 

This fund-raising would not have been neccessary, if St Thomas's Church had allowed those interested in acquiring the bell

to be given a chance to do that, instead of letting it go to the foundry in part payment for the new bells.

 

I am sure that any monies being raised under those circumstances, would have gone directly to the Church, and not the foundry.

All of this desperation to raise money by a deadline could have been avoided, and there would have been no need for the Civic Society to try to raise enough, as they are doing now.

 

Hill cliffe Walker. The WFM Article does not give a clear account of what happened.

It is quite usual when bells are being replaced for the old bells, if still in good condition, to be offered to other churches and if no one wants them they go to the foundry to be recycled into new bells.

No-one would have realised the significance of this bell until it was brought down from the tower and the inscription was noticed. It's only the fact that it's inscribed in memory of John Crosfield's wife that makes it so appealing to historians and the general public. But by the time that had been discovered it had already been agreed with the foundry that the scrap metal cost would be deducted off the Church's bill for works done.

I'm sure had the Diocese committee (who make the decisions)known that there could be potential interest from local history groups or whatever they would have been only too happy to negotiate. It would have been far easier and probably more cost effective for them.

 

St Thomas's has been working hard for years to raise funds for renovation and they've done a brilliant job! when it's finished and the new 'multiple peal' of bells is up and running it will be quite wonderful!

The renovation will have ensured that the church building can be enjoyed for generations to come. Thankfully we have an extremely hard working vicar with a deep respect for our heritage.

 

I do wish people writing these articles would pay a little more attention to detail as some seem to infer that the church has failed in some way - which it most certainly hasn't.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Diz, I am not at all surprised that Walton Parish Council have been the first to offer support. They have always been supportive of community issues, notably fighting the Walton Hall sell off and are respectful and protective of our heritage and community assets. They seem to lack the political bickering element seen so often in our parish and borough councils and work together for the good of the community. To me they are what Parish Councils should be about.

 

 A very big thank you to Walton Parish Council!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To those of you refusing to donate due to the Civic Society saying they will retain 50 per cent of the proceeds should they fail in reaching their target - how on earth do you expect a Civic Society to perform any useful function for our town if it has no funds?

I am a member of the Civic Society and know others who give up their time freely to run the organisation and try and protect what is left of our town.

I am heading off to Stockton heath now to help raise funds to save this unique piece of history.

Hope to see some of you there.

If you want a Civic Society with teeth we will need deep pockets to hire the best lawyers further down the road.

Fair comment Gary.  One things for sure with you being a member of the Civic Society we all know there is at least one very loud voice that can shout from the rooftops and show their teeth if need be :wink:

Do you realise just how loud and forceful you 'shouted' at me today by the way even though I HAVE donated already.  Good job I'm not of a nervous disposition :lol: :lol:

 

Anyway, as for the money having to be split 50/50 between Walton Lea and the Civics if enough isn't raised I doubt that's worth even worrying about now (for those who are).

 

The way things are going, and with the generosity and support already shown by people, there is a very strong chance that full deposit needed by Friday WILL be raised.

 

So who on here is now willing to donate then.....

 

Cash, cheque or online here if you prefer  http://uk.virginmoneygiving.com/charity-web/charity/displayCharityCampaignPage.action?charityCampaignUrl=SaveTheBell

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...