Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Dizzy

Warrington Transporter Bridge (BBC news)

Recommended Posts

 

 

BBC interviewed Andy Farrall for 15 minutes so don't judge what he said by the ten seconds they showed.

 

 

What an odd statement to make,

 

Andy Farrall seems to imply area will be redeveloped, is this not the case or what do you mean?

 

What else did he say?

 

PS: I forgot to say thanks for the pics Dizzy in my previous post,!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Some of us judge Andy Farrall on a lot more than an unseen 15 minute interview. As did the people of Chester and the High Court. 

 

I presume this is a mischievous reference to the Quinn Glass case. Didn't the Supreme Court eventually uphold Chester Council's approach?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe the High Court ruled it unlawful (which it was) but the Supreme Court allowed the Council to issue a retrospective planning permission, what with the thing already built with Andy Farrall's complete knowledge and all. 

 

Not to get too far off topic on this one but Farrall allowed it to be built without planning permission and environmental certification. Is that really the action of somebody we need working in Warrington? Would it be acceptable for Farrall to break the law and wave through a massive industrial plant in Warrington and then only deal with the consequences when other people hold their hands up about it? And did WBC really need to introduce somebody responsible for one unlawful act to head up a department already dealing with another?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Speaking of industrial plants.... just how did Rock Oil ever get permission to build their plant next to St Barnabas Primary School?

It's often made me wonder

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is an absolutely perfect example of the disregard of communities, environments and common sense that this Council, its officers and members have for the good folk of this town.  Nestling snuggly between the housing estate, school and hospital, a factory producing fuel and lubricant oil.  I wonder just how good Rock Oil were at "lubricating" the cogs???  Seriously?. give over, keep it real.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

.. I said I'd ask questions. Here's some answers.

 

Cheshire County Council took over the bridge, so when Warrington went unitary we had to buy it (for one pound). I haven't unearthed the terms on which Cheshire took it on (and why).

Thanks for trying and I'm sure you'll find it eventually. Maybe it's in a dusty drawer somewhere have you looked, just kidding :wink:

 

Have you asked the council's solicitors or just WBC's Land Charge/Terrier department as the legal dept may know more or know where to look.

Crosfield's should still have a copy though so maybe ask them.

 

I already have a copy of the Title and Plan for the Transporter Bridge as I have an account with Land Registry.

It doesn't show much though as a record was only filed with them by WBC in 2011 which is why I asked you. In brief here's what it says though in case you've not seen it yet.

 

Registered Owner - Warrington Borough Council

 

Price Stated - Not Available

 

1) (22.03.2011) The Leasehold land shown edged with red on the plan of the above title filed at the Registry and being Transporter Bridge, River

Mersey, Bank Quay, Warrington. NOTE: Only the Transporter Bridge spanning the River Mersey, together with the supports thereof at either end of such bridge, is included in

the title.

 

2) (22.03.2011) Short particulars of the lease(s) (or under-lease(s)) under which the land is held:

Date : 22 February 1978

Term : 50 years from 1 April 1977

Parties : (1) Joseph Crosfield & Sons Limited

(2) Cheshire County Council

 

3) (22.03.2011) The title includes any legal easements granted by the registered lease but is subject to any rights that are granted or

reserved by the said lease and affect the registered land.

 

4) (22.03.2011) The landlord's title is registered as to part of the land comprised in the lease.

 

Title good leasehold

1) (22.03.2011) PROPRIETOR: WARRINGTON BOROUGH COUNCIL of Town Hall,

Sankey Street, Warrington WA1 1UH and of P.O.Box 13, Quattro,

Buttermarket Street, Warrington WA1 1BN and of DX17760, Warrington

 

 

Question.... Do you have any idea why Cheshire County Council never registered it or why it took WBC until March 2011 to register it with Land Registry after they became unitary.

I'd have thought council(s) would have been a bit more organised and on the ball than that especially when it comes to their own ownerships, leases and land too etc although I do realise it wasn't compulsory until 1990 ish and then only when things changed hands but they could have voluntarily registered it any time they liked and surely with anything they own or lease that is very beneficial to WBC incase there are ever any disputes by other people over land/buildings and the likes. That's why we have a Land Registry.

Our engineer says it is still structurally sound (even though English Heritage have it "at risk" because of "deteriorating ironwork").

That good to hear but then why would English Heritage put it on their 'At Risk Register' as they must be quite concerned about it to do that. Do you know when the last structural survey report was done and which areas or ironwork are deteriorating ? If not can you find out please :D

 

The Council will look at having it painted - but I'm not saying I'd vote for that without knowing the cost.

Using the new epoxy paint, the Forth Bridge cost £130m to paint... but that is 1.5 miles long and our bridge is one-fortieth as long... it may not be an

exact comparison! If I've got the stats right, Forth Bridge is 50,000 tons of steel, Newport transporter bridge is 1,000 tons and ours about a third

that size, so even at 1/150 it's a big six-figure sum for a lick of paint...

I guess they would have to look into that in more detail though expecially as some bits are deteriorating so nit just a question of slapping some paint on, not that I thought it would be though. Infact I thought the work needed would be WAY more than that as I thought it was about to fall down with it being At Risk. Maybe the other companies there like Unilever would chip in. We could even get you some paint and

a brush for you to start the ball rolling and a what great photo shoot opportunity :wink:

BBC interviewed Andy Farrall for 15 minutes so don't judge what he said by the ten seconds they showed.
Do you know what else he said then or maybe he could do a press release to say it again as it does seem a shame that they only showed a few minutes

of his interview.

 

Thanks for the info so far though and it's appreciated. Looking forward to hearing more about the Lease and structural stuff etc and anything else you can find out too including the councils ideas so far... oh and anything you know about the talks that have been going on between English Heritage and WBC regarding the At Risk status.

 

It shouldn't take you long as you are a councilor so should have access to all that :D:wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Andy Farrall seems to imply area will be redeveloped, is this not the case or what do you mean?

 

It's been in the press a lot over the past year or so and part of the new bridge plans. There was a link to the plan drawing further up but if you want to know the

bigger picture that it;s all part of you'll have to read the doc that's for all the proposed redevelopmens in the whole of Warrington. Another topic for that maybe...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No doubt we will see a photo of the local Labour councillor pointing at the bridge in a forlorn manner in a few years.... just before an election and stating how the council were committed to preserving the local heritage of the town, but the bridge was just too bad to save....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I believe the High Court ruled it unlawful (which it was) but the Supreme Court allowed the Council to issue a retrospective planning permission, what with the thing already built with Andy Farrall's complete knowledge and all. 

 

Not to get too far off topic on this one but Farrall allowed it to be built without planning permission and environmental certification. Is that really the action of somebody we need working in Warrington? Would it be acceptable for Farrall to break the law and wave through a massive industrial plant in Warrington and then only deal with the consequences when other people hold their hands up about it? And did WBC really need to introduce somebody responsible for one unlawful act to head up a department already dealing with another?

http://www.chesterchronicle.co.uk/news/chester-cheshire-news/stuck-middle-over-glass-development-5288263

 

Is it quite as grey_man portrays the case? I'm not sure if the Supreme Court decision totally vindicated Farrall's advice but it seems less clear cut than the suggestion that Farrall "allowed it to be built", or that he somehow broke the law.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Facebook page has managed to reach the lofty heights of 620 'likes', hardly what you call overwhelming support, and one of those suggests moving it to Widnes where it will get more tourists ??????

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He clearly allowed it to be built. We're not talking about a conservatory in a quiet cul de sac. The council must have known it didn't have planning permission or environmental certification for the site and it was only when a competitor raised the issue that anything was done about it. It is one of those occasions when we cannot know what wheels have been turning and who knew what and when because councils hate light being shone into their little nooks and crannies. But we can surmise that the council and Andy Farrall were fully aware that a huge industrial plant was being built without consent and did absolutely nothing about it until they were forced.  

 

As for it being unlawful, that was the ruling of the HIgh Court. The Supreme Court only allowed retrospective permission from what I can tell.

 

My main point remains; given this unholy mess - not to mention all the other gripes the people of Chester had about his tenure - was Andy Farrall really the right person to introduce to Warrington's own scandal ridden planning team? I believe the answer is no and it did little to reassure anybody that the planning function is any more fit for purpose than it was before.

 

So, when questions arise about Warrington's heritage sites, we're expected to leave it all to somebody who allowed a building and a car park to be built on the site of an ancient Roman amphitheatre?   

 

By the way, isn't the Internet wonderful? A few minutes and you can unearth the following gems about the decision to build on the site of the amphitheatre without any form of public consultation: 

 

"You can debate this all you want but you can't stop it...." 
Andrew Farrall, Head of Planning, Chester City CouncilApril 2000

 

"We are witnessing an act of grotesque and needless cultural vandalism. What I saw in Chester beggars belief. No other country in the Western World would contemplate what is happening in Chester".
Shadow Culture Minister, Peter Ainsworth MP, May 2000

 

Just for anybody who thinks Warrington and its culture and heritage is safe in this man's hands. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Keep up PJ, It wasn't me that suggested it. I was just supporting the proposal. 

Who mentioned you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I went for a lovely walk earlier in the week.  No wonder English Heritage have put the Transporter Bridge on their 'Ar Risk' register.  Ok so maybe it's not about to fall down just yet (or is it ?) and my god how on earth could it have just been left and allowed to get like this  !!!! 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

 

Transporter%20Bridge%2018%20march%202015

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nice photos Dizzy

 

Thanks, could have been much better though if I'd been closer and not had to use my old little camera for the last 4  to zoom in :wink: :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For those who have shown interest in the past the ' Friends Of ' Warrington Transporter Bridge now have  a website as well as a facebook page. :D 

Website here.... http://www.warringtontransporterbridge.co.uk/index.html

Facebook Page here..... https://www.facebook.com/SaveWarringtonTransporterBridge

Seems the leader of the council (Clr Terry O'Neil) has now also pledged his full support to the group who are trying to save it and who are also trying to get funding for it too. 
(I'm trying my best to refrain from saying that maybe if he and his council and/or those before him had taken some interest BEFORE now in something they had the responsibility for then it wouldn't be in the state is it now and on the at risk register and so public time and intervention would not be needed !!)

Anyway... I only said it in italics so that doesn't count and it IS good that the council are at least listening too and backing the group :D 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PS...... I've not managed to do the jigsaw puzzle yet on their website so please don't tell me if you do  :lol: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...