Dizzy Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 front page news todayhttp://www.warrington-worldwide.co.uk/articles/20034/1/Warrington-Hospital-working-hard-to-get-back-on-track/Page1.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Think it follows, that any reductions in funding (as via "austerity"); will eventually be felt at the coal face. Council Social Care Services are being reduced due to Gov cuts, thus elderly folk on Hospital wards, who are fit enough to leave, have nowhere suitable to go, hence bed blocking back to A&E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Another interesting factor, according to the head of emergency medicine; is the number of Doctors leaving for other fields or emigrating; due to basically complete exhaustion or exasperation. So presumably, we're helping to fund the Ozzy health service, with trained Doctors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davy51 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Well ,apparently the privately run Hinchingbrook NHS Hospital in East Anglia is also feeling the pressure of A&E & its operators are running for the hills, stating that the challenge is too much for their relatively small company. Maybe this reaction will deter governments from putting health in the private sector.Evidently the experiment was the initiative of the last Labour government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Davy, that's the thing with experiments. Some succeed some don't, but without experimenting you won't arrive at a workable solution to the problem. Throwing more and more money at the NHS is not going to solve the problems that obviously exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 If only you were right Asp; there is huge growth in demand due to an elderly demographic that is living longer, but sadly not necessarily in good health. The social care services required tend to be labour intensive and ultimately expensive; so unless we move to euthanasia (I'm not advocating that btw!); we're going to have to get our wallets out, one way or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 But the problems with the NHS are there despite the huge amounts of money thrown at it, not because of a lack of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latchford Locks Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 If only you were right Asp; there is huge growth in demand due to an elderly demographic that is living longer, but sadly not necessarily in good health. The social care services required tend to be labour intensive and ultimately expensive; so unless we move to euthanasia (I'm not advocating that btw!); we're going to have to get our wallets out, one way or the other. Crickey you had me worried there for a minute I know I'm at the airport, But I don't want to be in the departure lounge just yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Arguably, the NHS is a victim of it's own success; folk are living longer, with spare parts, new parts, tablets etc; but most are at risk of all sorts of accidents or poor resistance to infection due to age related frailty. Some diseases such as dementia, are more prevalent with age; and one can see that demand levels are high. Most situations can be managed through medically supervised care homes or home care; which would take pressure from the Hospitals and free up bed - BUT, inevitably that will cost money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 But the problem is that most of the money thrown at the NHS is spent on non-medical items or unnecessary treatments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I would agree, that mis-spends exist (depending on one's point of view); that's why I think there's a need for a public conversation as to just what the extent of the NHS should be. Should it for example; provide sex change operations, IVF, cosmetic surgery, joint replacements with a lifespan of 15 years to 90 year olds? Should proof of contributions be a requirement for treatment, and should all funding be based on NI contributions? And perhaps most importantly; should politicians be kept totally out of using it as a political football, by making it an arms length organisation, run by independent clinicians? Then of course, there's the question of complementary services such as elderly care, or preventative medicine,. and whether some degree of integration is required? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 NI contributions are a red herring as it is, and always has been, a Ponzi scheme with no relevamce to health whatsoever. And as I said a lot of the money that should be spent on healthcare is spent on irrelevancies like bean counters checking on how much a hospital is profiting from car parking etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Think most of us have discerned the nonsense nature of current funding, which allows the politicians to play games; a separate NI system would hopefully take the politicians out of the equation. Perhaps it's not the "bean counters" per se. but their salaries that need to be questioned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Think most of us have discerned the nonsense nature of current funding, which allows the politicians to play games; a separate NI system would hopefully take the politicians out of the equation. Perhaps it's not the "bean counters" per se. but their salaries that need to be questioned? So you're advocating an insurance backed system then? Sort of - if you haven't paid your insurance then no treatment? Now which major country has such a system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Think we've discussed it on previous topics, and I believe Steve informed us that the German system was based on insurance; as indeed was the NHS originally (NI). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asperity Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 NI was always a Ponzi scheme, never designed to be able to pay for what it was supposed to. An extra income tax if you like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davy51 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 It seems that problems are being caused by bed blocking because there are insufficient NHS beds . Maybe an idea would be to upgrade the staff at care & retirement homes so elderly people who have been treated in hospital can continue their treatment & care in familiar surroundings so not taking up unnecessary bed space because there is nowhere for them to go. Let care homes become an important extension of the health service with qualified nursing staff capable of providing some of their own A&E to residents & aftercare from hospital visits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 There is less capacity due to cuts at the care homes. Old people who are well enough to leave are left in hospital as there is nowhere else for them to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Maybe an idea would be to upgrade the staff at care & retirement homes so elderly people who have been treated in hospital can continue their treatment & care in familiar surroundings so not taking up unnecessary bed space because there is nowhere for them to go. Let care homes become an important extension of the health service with qualified nursing staff capable of providing some of their own A&E to residents & aftercare from hospital visits. Already happening, there are at least 3 such establishments in Halton. http://www.nhs.uk/CarersDirect/guide/practicalsupport/Pages/extra-care.aspx Widnes http://www.housingcare.org/housing-care/facility-info-158740-naughton-fields-widnes-england.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Dave, I suggested that earlier; problem is - funding to Councils, who make such care provision has been cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazj Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 But this council is still providing free staff parking while cutting care services Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davy51 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 All in the pretext of keeping council tax bills down Obs ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 National Gov sets the limits on Council Tax rises; it also decides levels of rate support grant. Social Services is one of the most expensive budget areas, so scrapping free staff car parking (although I agree with the idea); may not cover the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P J Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 I see the Farage balloon has flip flopped again, you couldn't make it up. Well he could and seems to do so on the spot. Clearly you cannot trust a word he says http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nigel-farage-nhs-might-have-to-be-replaced-by-private-health-insurance-9988904.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Think if you read it properly, Nigel is calling for a debate, the Party policy remains committed to an NHS free at the point of need; nowt wrong with Insurance based system anyway (as we've discussed on here); as long as it's "national" insurance. The problem you've got, is that UKIP support is a rejection of the LibLabCons; who've had 40 odd years and led us into a mess; it's a protest vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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