Grappenhall 19th Century

[suestandish]

Hi again to all, thanks for your help last time now I have another question for you.

 

Does anyone know where  Morris Brook Cottages were?.  There must of been a long row of them as my ancestors lived at 77 and 96.  Have searched a map at Warrington Library but they are not listed.  Looking at the 1881 Census they could of been close to the village and Knutsford Road.  Any help appreciated.

[algy]

Sue, Morris Brook cottages were situated on Morris Brook farm and probably occupied by the farms workers, Morris Brook is the boundary  that divides Grappenhall from Thelwall, I have looked at Morris Brook from its source to its running into the River Mersey in 1874 and there are no other Morris Brook cottages. The maps below and Google map screenshot show where the farm would have been located, hope this helps.

 

1874

 

 

1896

 

 

1907

 

2013 - Approximate Location

[suestandish]

Once again Algy I thank you for your help, I had discarded the idea they were near the farm or part of it, as these people were very well off for the time and was looking more at a good sized house, guess life is full of surprises.  One of them was a Chemist and another a Cement Manufacturer so plenty of money coming in.

[algy]

Sue what names are you searching for, I have directories that may turn them up.

[Dizzy]

I wonder whether Morris Brook Cottage (there seems to have only one cottage and not a row of them ) was a rather nice residence going from the census records I looked at earlier many others who had lived in cottage over the years also seemed to be in good jobs and so probably rather wealthy too.  Maybe it wasn't part of the actual farm as such and was larger than imagined or just named 'cottage' as there was already a Morris Brook House (that was the Farms original name) and both were in the Morris Brook area.   Just a guess and probably completely wrong though

 

Others who lived in the cottage over the years were as follows (you probably know all this anyway Sue but I know that Algy likes to know these sorts of things about places he's found on maps.  We both become a little obsessed with the need to know don't we Algy 

 

Residents of Morris Brook Cottage (sometimes just referred to as 'Morris Brook' 

 

1841 - A chap called Peter who was a Lawyer  (in 1841 the Farm itself was called 'Morris Brook House' )

 

1851 - A lady called Alice who was a Railway Proprietor (in 1851 both the farm and cottage just say 'Morris Brook' but are separate residencies)

 

1861 - No idea as the census stated that 'Family all away from house April 7th' (in 1861 the Farm is still called 'Morris Brook House' and the cottage 'Morris Brook Cottage'.  On this census there is also a Morris Brook Lane shown before the farm/cottage record with 6 homes on (mainly tanners living in those) but the road doesn't seem to appear on any other census year returns, not that I can see anyway)

 

1871 - from what you said earlier these must be your people Sue (you would have thought the 3 lads given their careers would have moved into their own homes rather than living with their mum and sister eh?.  Both the farm and cottage are named the same as in 1861)

 

1881 -  two of your lads still doing same jobs and living there with their sister who now has an occupation 'house property', their cousin (a vicars wife), and a domestic servant in their home.  There are seemingly 3 properties called 'Morris Brook' listed together on this census although the middle residence just has a servant in it so maybe that was a error by the enumerator or the servant had their own 'home' in part of what was the farm house or an outbuilding ? No idea.

 

1891 - Did the farm house and/or cottage become a ?temporary? Hospital as I can't find either of them on this census  but there seems to be a Hospital in the same location with a surgeon, 2 nurses, a cook, a servant and 9 patients ?  but then that wouldn't really make sense as in 1901 it's back to a farm and house again.   I;'m confused now !

 

1901 - The cottage is listed again and is home to a laundress, wheelwright, blacksmith, 2 unemployed and a domestic servant  (and the Morris Brook Farm is listed again with Joseph Clare the farmer.

 

1911 – same family as above in what was the cottage, a wheelwright (employer), Laundress, Rought Steel Bar Reeler and a domestic servant.  Listed as simply 'Morris Brook’  (Morris Brook Farm still with Joseph Clare)

 

Sorry about the length of that Sue especially as no doubt you will already know it all 

[algy]

Dizz, this simply does not make sense, Sue says it is Morris Brook cottages Nos.77 & 96, that means that the cottages are on two different sides of the road (odds & evens), whereas Morris Brook farm has only the between one and three cottages?, I have searched from it's source down to the Mersey and there are no more dwellings near enough to the brook to warrant that name.

[Dizzy]

Eh ?..... what do you mean that Morris Brook Farm has 'only the between one and three cottages' ??  Please explain as I don't understand. 

 

I didn't make sense to me really but I had a free hour while I was waiting for something.

 

I did wonder about Sue's mention of no's 77 and 96 but I looked at every record I could find for 'Morris Brook' and went back and forwarsd too a bit on all the census returns to see roads before and after but maybe not far enough. 

 

Mmm.  You have made me wonder though as maybe Sue meant 'schedule numbers' 77 and 96 but that still doesn't explain why my search for Morris Brook didn't find any others though even when I looked in the street listings and oddity recordson FMP  for each census blah blah blah. 

 

Maybe I am losing it after all but I don't think I am    Where and what should I look for now then any ideas ?

 

PS Surely odds and evens WERE sometimes on the same side of a road back then though too.  Both my adjoining neighbours are odd and I'm definitely not     

[Dizzy]

Please Sue, if you happen to read this can you shine some light on it and correct me so I don't have a sleepless night pondering  

[suestandish]

Thanks again for your help, seems that the Layland siblings stuck together throughout their lives, none of them married and all of them very wealthy, I know the last 2 brothers moved again onto Chester Road and lived at  numbers 111 and 140, then the last remaining brother moved to Beechfield Chester Road on 1911 Census where he died and left over £6000 to friends.  I don't know what to make of Morris Brook Cottage (s) the map of 1907 shows either a substantial property or indeed a row of smaller ones.