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francine

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I'm surprised that Kije isn't in favour of Herman Van Rompuy being on our notes now.... not that British bloke! :lol:

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Apparently there is someone jumping up & down now saying that more women should be shown on our notes apart from Helen Mirren  on the front !

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Some are always jumping up and down about more women in this or that, especially in the boardroom - women were running the CQC - SAY NO MORE!

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Surprised Baz is agreeing with Churchill, thought he would have gone for Mosley :wink:

 

You are a strange little man at times Kije...... Mosley was a fascist.... and far too left wing for my liking!! :lol:  :lol:  

 

Churchill saved us from the Germans Kije...... something that this country seemed to have forgotten but is now waking up to the realisation that the fourth Reich is rising and we need to get out before they finish the job on us that Hitler started....... and we have no Churchill this time; this time it will be up to the people, not the politicians to save us

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I thought fascism was right wing as stated in 'Doctrine of Fascism' by Mussolini - quote "Fascism is opposed to Socialism"

I believe Marxism is left wing. Or is it?

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I thought fascism was right wing as stated in 'Doctrine of Fascism' by Mussolini - quote "Fascism is opposed to Socialism"

I believe Marxism is left wing. Or is it?

 

do try and keep up foxy.... I was making a joke about fascists being too left wing because I am even more right wing than they are...... and I thought Kije was slow

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From "The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics":

 

The fascist leaders’ antagonism to communism has been misinterpreted as an affinity for capitalism. In fact, fascists’ anticommunism was motivated by a belief that in the collectivist milieu of early-twentieth-century Europe, communism was its closest rival for people’s allegiance. As with communism, under fascism, every citizen was regarded as an employee and tenant of the totalitarian, party-dominated state. Consequently, it was the state’s prerogative to use force, or the threat of it, to suppress even peaceful opposition.

If a formal architect of fascism can be identified, it is Benito Mussolini, the onetime Marxist editor who, caught up in nationalist fervor, broke with the left as World War I approached and became Italy’s leader in 1922. Mussolini distinguished fascism from liberal capitalism in his 1928 autobiography:

The citizen in the Fascist State is no longer a selfish individual who has the anti-social right of rebelling against any law of the Collectivity. The Fascist State with its corporative conception puts men and their possibilities into productive work and interprets for them the duties they have to fulfill. (p. 280)

 

 

In other words Fascism is just another form of Communism. The individual is the property of the state. This is left wing Socialism under two banners. Hitler and Stalin were just fighting over which form of Socialism was the ruler, it was never the right wing against the left wing.

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One slight addendum:  Communism (or commonly referred to as Stalinism) was State Capitalism as opposed to the Trotskyite theory of International Socialism (or world revolution by the global proletariat against their capitalist exploiters); as simplified in Orwell's "Animal Farm".

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Hey call it what you want Obs, but the point is that Communism, Stalinism and Fascism are all left wing idealologies however much today's Socialists would like to distance themselves from them. The left murder more people than they convince that their policies are correct. Socialism stinks.

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In other words Fascism is just another form of Communism.

Can you let Baz know, he's confused about his right and his left.

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Asp; it's people who operate these ideological systems; so perhaps it's people that "stink". Capitalism, like Feudalism before it, was equally responsible for death and destruction; it all depends which side of the tracks one is born on.

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Not on the industrial scale achieved by Socialists though Obs.

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The billions upon billions of human beings that have died prematurely through slavery, grinding poverty and starvation, industrial accidents, preventable diseases etc etc; weren't recorded as a single incident like the holocaust, so probably create less sensation. Never the less, mankind tends to be a selfish and greedy species, and for every one who reaches the top of the slippery pyramid, there are thousands at the base - whatever ideological system you employ.

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The truth is that all those causes of death you itemise also happen under socialism, but they are in addition to the mass murder committed under the socialist banner. I get the impression you are an apologist for socialist murderers Obs.

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Quite the opposite; I recognise that no system yet tried, has delivered for the peons; we finish up being Governed by one elite or another; who take the majority of the cake, leaving the crumbs for the plebs to fight over. With the wealth gap now increasing, the powers that be, have the audacity to punish the many for the sins of the few.

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Obs you are obviously stumbling through life with blinkers on. Never in the whole of human history have so many previously poverty stricken people in the world been lifted out of said poverty. This is thanks to the spread of globalised industry and capitalism, not thanks to socialism which managed to keep the masses downtrodden for much of the 20th century. And by the way when I speak of poverty I mean real poverty, not the "can't afford the latest trainers/iphone/wide screen tv" type of poverty that is referred to in this country.

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